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guranda doliZis xma aWaraSi mcxovrebi yvela adamianis ojaxSi aTeulobiT weli ismoda `aWaris televiziisa da radios~ eTeridan. axla xalxis xmas TviTon usmens, radgan politikaSi gadainacvla. igi xelvaCauris municipalitetis sakrebulos gundTan erTad cdilobs mosaxleobis problemebis mogvarebas. hyavs erTi Svili – merabiko, romelic dedis kvals (guranda mReris) gahyva, ramdenime instrumentze ukravs da mReris.
guranda doliZe dRes Cveni stumaria.
– qalbatono guranda, mokled mogviyeviT im mravalferovan da saintereso cxovrebaze, romelic dRemde ganvleT.
– davibade da gavizarde aWaraSi, erT-erT yvelaze gamorCeul da ulamazes sofel maxinjaurSi. skolis damTavrebis Semdeg, swavla gavagrZele baTumis SoTa rusTavelis saxelmwifo universitetSi, germanuli enisa da literaturis specialobiT. Semdeg muSaoba daviwye leqtorad damoukidebel universitetSi, Tumca maleve mivxvdi, rom es Cemi saqme ar iyo da. . . Cems cxovrebaSi daiwyo axali, Zalian saintereso etapi, romelic aWaris radiosa da televizias ukavSirdeba. viyavi radios, aseve televiziis diqtori, wamyvani, korespondenti, wamyvan-reportiori, prodiuseri. mimyavda gadacema `genderuli saubrebi~, gaxldiT gadacemis `qali da arCevnebi~ prodiuseri, wlebis ganmavlobaSi, genderuli Tanasworobis qselis baTumis koordinatoris funqciasac vasrulebdi, gavlili maqvs uamravi treningi am mimarTulebiT, maT Soris `qalebis CarTuloba politikur procesebSi~. vmuSaobdi sareklamo Jurnal `biznes-nota~-Si. sakmaod saintereso samuSao iyo. 2000 wels `telearx 25~-Si viyavi gadacema `personas~’ wamyvani da prodiuseri. var xelovani adamiani: Cemi hobi simReraa, miyvars sxvadasxva kulturuli da gasarTobi RonisZiebis organizeba. amJamad xelvaCauris sakrebulos wevri var `qarTuli ocneba – demokratiuli saqarTvelos~ erTiani partiuli siiT, vxelmZRvanelob municipalitetis ganaTlebis, kulturis, sportis, turizmisa da axalgazrdobis saqmeTa komisias, var, aseve, genderuli Tanasworobis sabWos Tavmjdomare. arc ise didi xnis win dedaCemis naTesavebi aRmovaCine, romlebsac is sul eZebda. bebiis bebia germaneli myavda – polina gultnaideri. ai, Turme germaniis mimarT Cemi aseTi siyvarulis mizezi ra yofila. dedas axloblebi, Cven sayvarel anelia lukovkinasTan erTad (dedis biZaSvili), romelic Semodgomaze gavicaniT, londonSi cxovroben, Turme gvyavs uamravi naTesavi TbilisSic. bebia (dedis deda) rusi ebraeli iyo. myavs aseve uamravi naTesavi mamis mxridan. mamaCemis deda bolqvaZe iyo, 10 dedmamiSvilidan – erT-erTi. bebiis 2 Zma 1937 wels daxvrites: genjali bolqvaZe aWaris samxedro komisari iyo, ismaili – komkavSiris baTumis raikomis mdivani. mamaCemis dedis dilis rituali aseTi iyo: gamoaRebda fanjrebs, daalagebda Zmebis fotoebs da xmamaRla tiroda. 1949 wels Cemi ojaxi yazaxeTSi gadaasaxles, mama maSin 12 wlis iyo. Aai, aseTi mravalferovani ojaxi myavs.
– xom ar genatrebaT radioSi gatarebuli wlebi?
– 21 weli gavatare Cems usayvarles aWaris radioSi. es arcTu ise mcire droa! cud xasiaTzec rom vyofiliyavi, amas Cemi msmeneli ver mixvdeboda. rodesac mikrofoni irTveboda da viwyebdi `eTerSia axali ambebi guranda doliZesTan erTad~, yvelaferi cudi iq mTavrdeboda. imdenad miyvarda es saqme, rom yvela stresi mexsneboda, momwonda is, rom radio operatiulia da msmeneli informacias pirvelad Cemgan igebda. mqonda bedniereba, wameyvana sainformacio-SemecnebiTi gadacemebi baton anzor CikaSuasTan erTad. CemTvis aWaris radio, upirveles yovlisa, iyo da iqneba anzor CikaSua. sxvaTa Soris, radiomsmenelebi wamyvanebs xmiT cnoben. ucxo garemoSi saubars rom daviwyebdi, Tqven wamyani ar xarTo? – mekiTxebodnen. mokled, Cems radioze da kolegebze, romlebic lxinsa Tu WirSi yovelTvis gverdSi medgnen, dausruleblad SemiZlia saubari. Cemi merabikoc radioSi gaizarda, Cems kolegebs amaSi didi wvlili miuZRviT, isinic mexmarebodnen. erT kuriozs mogiyvebiT: merabiko Zalian gaminawyenda, radiodan rom wamovedi (yvelafers aqvs dasasruli da mec mindoda cvlileba). didxans ver Seegua amas. rodesac davurekavdi imis gasarkvevad, Tu sad iyo gakveTilebis Semdeg, mpasuxobda, radios karTan vdgavaro. yvelaze mTavari gamomrCa kinaRam – Cemi da samsaxurSi Cemi ufrosi iyo da yvelaze met SeniSvnas me maZlevda. vxumrob xolme, viTmine, viTmine da bolos amoviRe xma, aRar davujere da wamovedi Cemi municipalitetis sakrebuloSi.
– xSirad atarebdiT da atarebT saqvelmoqmedo koncertebs, ra gancdaa, rodesac adamianebs exmarebiT?
– jer kidev skolaSi swavlisas, Semdeg universitetSi da dResac ki, organizebas vuwev sxvadasxva saxis koncertsa da Sou-programas, maT Soris, saqvelmoqmedos. dRes ukve Zalian cnobili bevri momRerali Cems organizebul saRamoebSi monawileobda da swored am koncertebze gamosvlis Semdeg did warmatebasac aRwevda. erTgvari Tilisma iyo iq simRera an cekva. dRes isini Cemi megobrebi arian. erTad, absoluturad usasyidlod, Zalian bevri saqvelmoqmedo saRamo dagvigegmavs da adamianTa sicocxle SegvinarCunebia, gadagvixdia Tanxa operaciisTvis, an, Tundac, sazRvargareT gamgzavrebisTvis. saqvelmoqmedo koncertebis organizeba aWaris radioSi muSaobisas daviwye. dRes SemiZlia vTqva, rom var Zalian bednieri imiT, rom megobrebTan erTad, Zalian bevri bavSvi gadavarCine. erT-erTi bolo, grandiozuli saqvelmoqmedo koncerti xelvaCauris municipalitetSi, enriko mamalaZis dasaxmareblad CavatareT, romelic salibaurSi cxovrobs (mas Tavis tvinis simsivne daudginda). koncertSi mTeli municipaliteti CaerTo da bavSvi safrangeTSi gavamgzavreT. 13 wlis enrikos gadarCenis imedi aravis hqonda, magram, RmerTis nebiT, igi dRes kargadaa da sareabilitacio kurss gadis. visurvebdi, arasodes dagvWirvebodes am xasiaTis koncertebi, yvela bavSvi iyos janmrTeli da bednieri!
– RmerTma gisminoT. axla politikaze gvesaubreT. xelvaCauris municipalitetis sakrebulos wevri xarT, ra sirTuleebs awydebiT an dadebiTs ras xedavT am saqmianobaSi?
– politika CemTvis yovelTvis iyo da iqneba saSualeba miznis misaRwevad: vakeTo sasikeTo saqmeebi Cemi qveynisTvis da Cveni moqalaqeebisTvis. aristoteles azriT: `politika, es aris adamianuri saqmianobis umaRlesi forma, ramdenadac misi meSveobiT adamianur urTierTobebSi yalibdeba samarTlianoba da miiRweva saerTo sikeTe~. sikeTis misaRwevad ki, vfiqrob, erT-erTi mTavari faqtori, gadawyvetilebis mimRebTa rigebSi bevri qalis yofnaa. am dRemde didi nebisyofiTa da saqmisadmi upirobo siyvaruliT movedi. es ar iyo ioli gza. uamravi dabrkoleba gamoviare, bevri barieri gadavlaxe, usamarTlobasa da imedgacruebaze aRarafers vityvi. Tumca, yvelaferi davZlie ojaxisa da megobrebis daxmarebiT. vTvli, rom var aqtiuri moqalaqe, es ki Zalian bevr wamowyebasa da saqmeSi mexmareba. rogorc giTxariT, ganaTlebis, kulturis, sportis, turizmisa da axalgazrdobis saqmeTa komisias vxelmZRvanelob. am mimarTulebiT bevri programa moqmedebs municipalitetSi, biujetic gonivrulad igegmeba: tardeba bevri treningi, Sexvedra, sportuli Sejibreba, ewyoba turebi turizmis mimarTulebiT, vexmarebiT warCinebul, aseve, socialurad daucvel moswavleebsa da studentebs, vzrunavT veteranebze, vmsjelobT sxvadasxva iniciativaze, vcdilobT, Cveni municipaliteti iyos gamorCeuli da amisTvis Zalisxmevasac ar viSurebT. didi survili maqvs, xelvaCaurSi eTnografiuli festivali gavmarToT, rom Cveni municipaliteti regionSi am mimarTulebiTac ganviTardes. msurs, sportuli SedegebiTac sakuTari adgili davimkvidroT msoflio rukaze. da Tu am rukaze varsebobdiT da varsebobT, es Cveni TviTmyofadobis, Cveni warsulis damsaxurebaa, rac Cvens unikalurobas gansazRvravs.
– sagangebo mdgomareobis periodSi vici, rom didi xnis ocneba aisruleT da soflis meurneobas mihyaviT xeli. ra mosavals elodeba `fermeri~’ guranda?
– me da Cem das mSoblebma maxinjaurSi saxl-kari da miwis nakveTi dagvitoves. mama metyoda xolme, miwa arasdros gayido, jer erTi, Cveni winaprebisaa, meorec, dadgeba iseTi dro, roca miwis mcire gojs moZebnis xalxio da. . . movida es droc! Sromis kulturaze minda giTxraT: sityva `kultura~ laTinuri warmoSobisaa da erT-erTi definiciiT is movlas, gadamuSavebasa da gaSenebas niSnavs. Tavisi sawyisi mniSvnelobiT es cneba germanelma iuristma, istorikosma da filosofosma samuel fon pufendorfma gamoiyena. adre mikvirda, Tumca dRevandeli gadasaxedidan vxvdebi, ratom daukavSira man iseTi globaluri instituti, rogoric kulturaa – agrowarmoebas. kultura adamianis sulieri da moraluri, eTikuri da esTetikuri erTobliobis definiciaa. miwis movla-gadamuSaveba CemTvis sulieri simSvidea. rodesac ucxoeTSi, janmrTelobis SenarCunebis mizniT, regularulad daviwye siaruli, iq mcxovrebma emigrantma, Cveni ojaxis didma megobarma aleko kalandariSvilma, romelsac turistuli biznesi aqvs, damaTvalierebina evropis sxvadasxva qveyanaSi arsebuli safermero meurneobebi. warmoidgineT, aTvalierebT germaniis, holandiis, safrangeTis, italiis, espaneTis da sxva qveynebis RirsSesaniSnaobebs, mgzavrobT manqaniT da mTeli gza ar gtovebT gancda, rom iq mcxovreb adamianebs uyvarT TavianTi miwa-wyali, rom arc erT goja miwas dauxvnels ar toveben, yvelaferi movlilia, yvelgan raRac xarobs. umaRles donezea ayvanili mosaxleobis Sromis kultura. weliwadSi samjer mohyavT mosavali. Cemi TvaliT maqvs nanaxi, rogor wmends sakuTar ezos 102 wlis milioneri bebo da yvavilebiT amkobs, traqtoriT rogor muSaobs qali, romelsac ori Tvis bavSvi gverdiT uwevs. roca samSobloSi davbrundi, Semrcxva, rom aseTi movlili meurneoba ar mqonda, sindisis qenjnas ganvicdidi, vfiqrobdi, rogor movuwodo mosaxleobas Sromis kulturis amaRlebisken, rodesac Tavad ar vakeTeb amas. ar mqonda dro amisTvis, radgan ojaxSi mxolod me vmuSaob da mTeli dRe saxlidan gasuli var. hoda, pandemias pozitiurad Sevxede: vmuSaobdi distanciurad, ar vwyvetdi komunikacias mosaxleobasTan. rogorc manamde giTxariT, Cem sulier simSvides mivxede da miwis damuSaveba daviwye. davTeseT Zalian bevri bostneuli kultura: pomidori, kitri, lobio, simindi, kartofili, gogra, badrijani, patisoni, mwvanilebi, vakeTeb calke yvavilebis kuTxes, xili maqvs uamravi saxeobis, vrgavT axal nargavebs, naadrevi jiSis citrusisa da laimis dargvasac vapireb, male auzSi, romelSic gamdinare wyalia, Tevzs movaSeneb. minda qaTmebi da msxvilfexa saqonelic viyolio, rac niadagis ganayofierebasac Seuwyobs xels (ori msxvilfexa saqoneli myavda ukve). infrastruqturis mowyoba ar damWirdeba, radgan mamaCemma yvelaferi damitova. ra Tqma unda, marto verafers gavxdebodi, Cemi meuRlec Zalian mexmareba.
– simRera ra adgils ikavebs Tqvens cxovrebaSi?
– is CemTvis haeri, wyali da sakvebia! roca vmReri, yvelaferi ukan rCeba. simReriT bevri adamianis problemac gadamiWria. rogorc ukve giTxariT, xSirad mimyavda sxvadasxva saRamo Tu koncerti. yofila momenti, roca programiT gaTvaliswinebuli nomeri, momRerlis avadmyofobis gamo, unda Cavardniliyo. swored maSin vifiqre, rom me Semesrulebina rame. gamomivida imaze ukeT, vidre velodi. megobrebmac wamaxalises. hoda, imdenad Sevedi rolSi, rom Cemi solo-koncertic gamimarTavs. mikrofoni miyvars Zalian, muSaoba vici masTan. radiom didi roli iTamaSa amaSi.
– Svilic dedis kvals gahyva, saukeTesod ukravs gitaraze da mReris. mogviyeviT merabikoze.
– jer skolaSi swavlobs, mReris da ukravs sxvadasxva instrumentze. erT moments gavixseneb: koncerti mqonda, vmRerodi da uceb, saidanRac, meore xma mesmis. Turme, merabikos mikrofoni `mouparavs~ da. . . ase vimRereT duetSi nato gelaSvilis `dekemberi dadgao~. sami wlis iyo maSin. ovaciebi ar wydeboda. sul mikrofoniT mxedavda: radioSi, koncertebze da masac es seni Seeyara _ uyvars mikrofoni. wels baTumis meriis mier mowyobil saaxalwlo koncertze imRera, SarSan minskSi gamarTul konkursSi meore adgilze gavida. TandaTan ipyrobs mwvervalebs. mas Tavisi samyaro aqvs, axla yalibdeba merabikos azrebi momavalze, Tavad unda gadawyvitos, ra unda, me davexmarebi. wels revaz laRiZis saxelobis samusiko skolaSi apirebs swavlis gagrZelebas. mokled, win didi gzaa. pirveli solo-koncerti 9 wlis asakSi gamarTa, SSm mozardebTan erTad, maTi monawileobiT.
– adgili, sadac Tavs komfortulad grZnobT?
– yvelaze komfortulad Tavs maxinjaurSi, Cem saxlSi vgrZnob. yvela, vinc mstumrobs, ambobs, rom saxls naTeli aura aqvs da `bednierebis saxlsac~ eZaxian. xSirad davdivar sazRvargareT da iqac sul Cem saxlze vfiqrob. sul mgonia, rom aq ded-mama melodeba. yoveli dRis dasasruls erTi suli maqvs, mivide im garemoSi, sadac sulieri simSvide meufleba da sruli komforti maqvs.
– didi samegobro wre gyavT. datvirTuli grafikidan gamomdinare xom ar moakeliT maT yuradReba?
– megobrebi TiTqmis yvela sferoSi myavs, rogorc saqarTveloSi, ise sazRvargareT. datvirTuli grafikis miuxedavad, maT naxvas yovelTvis vaxerxeb, radgan vcdilob, dro sworad gadavanawilo. maxsovs yvelas dabadebis dRe da vici, vis ra uxaria an uWirs. SemiZlia diliT adre avdge, puric davacxo, kerZic movamzado, wavide samsaxurSi, vimuSao, mere ki megobrebi movinaxulo.
– samzareulo ra adgils ikavebs Tqvens cxovrebaSi?
– samzareuloSi fusfusi didad ar miyvars, Tumca, yoveldRiur sauzmeze, sadilsa da vaxSamze zrunva mainc Cemi movaleobaa. Cemi da ki gurmania, arafrisgan iseT raRacas da Tan ise mcire droSi gaakeTebs, gakvirvebuli var. deda da mama kvebis sakiTxs sxvanairad wyvetdnen. wina dRiT unda scodnodaT, vis ra kerZi undoda. isini sul dakavebulebi iyvnen, Tumca, sauzmes orive erTad akeTebda. samzareuloSi patara dafa gvqonda, damxmare qals davuwerdiT am dafaze dRis menius, Tavisi aucilebeli pirveli, meore kerZiT da desertiT. aseTi cxovreba me dRes ar maqvs. Tumca, myavs araCveulebrivi mezoblebi da naTesavebi, romlebic mexmarebian. roca saWiroa, mec maT gverdiT var. ise, ugemrielesi kerZebi gamomdis, gansakuTrebiT, amolesili lobio da Romi. Tu winaswar Sematyobines, stumrad movdivarTo, or saaTSi saucxoo sufras gavSli. Tumca, aris iseTi dReebic, roca saerTod araferi maqvs.
– ras SecvlidiT Tqvens cxovrebaSi?
– mgoni – arafers, imitom, rom Zalian saintereso da mravalferovani cxovreba maqvs, erTaderTi _ bevr Svils ki gavaCendi. saerTod, uflis nebiT xdeba yvelaferi.
– rodis tiris Tqvennairi Zlieri qali?
– Zalian gulCvili var. SemiZlia vitiro filmze, rodesac adamiani adamians Cagravs, rodesac bavSvebs raime uWirT, sixarulisganac vtiri. zogadad, emociuri var.
– gegmebzec gvesaubreT.
– Zalian bevri idea mitrialebs TavSi. ra Tqma unda, sadac unda viyo, yovelTvis viqnebi xalxis samsaxurSi, yovelgvari populistobis gareSe. dRevandel intervius ki ilia WavWavaZis araCveulebrivi leqsiT davasrulebdi, romelic Zalian momwons da swored es aris Cemi cxovrebis kredo:
`kacad maSin xar saqebi,
Tu es wesi wesad darge:
yovel dResa Sens Tavs hkiTxo,-
aba, me dRes vis ra varge?~.
