რეპრესირებულები მხოლოდ 37 ლარს ითხოვენ!
irma cecxlaZe; 27 48 93 –
„iq dRemde ismis RamRamobiT kvnesa, oxvra, xmebi“. . .
Tanamedrove axalgazrdebis umetesobam araferi icis sabWoTa reJimis periodSi represirebulTa Sesaxeb. maSin praqtikaSi miRebuli iyo wamebis usastikesi meTodebi, romlis meSveobiTac nebismier SeTiTxnil braldebaze awerinebdnen xels TavianT msxverpls da Semdeg, konveieriviT awyobili sistemiT, xvretdnen, Tanac ise, rom daRupulis axloblebs saflavis adgilmdebareobasac ar atyobinebdnen.
aseTi saflavebi dRemde Cven gverdiTaa. iq ganurCevlad marxia muslimi, qristiani, iudeveli. udanaSaulod daxvretilTa sulebi aqamde elian samarTals – wesis agebas da adamianurad dakrZalvas iTxoven.
Tu rogor unda moqceuliyo am xalxis winaSe mTavroba, romelic wina xelisuflebis samarTalmemkvidred moiazreba da cxadia, gaaCnia garkveuli pasuxismgebloba udanaSaulod wamebuli Tu daxvretili Tanamoqalaqeebis da maTi Svilebis winaSe, sakmaod sakamaTo Tema aRmoCnda. am sakiTxis irgvliv daZabuli debatebi mimdinareobda politikosTa, iuristTa, advokatTa da mosamarTleTa uSualo monawileobiT.
mTel am process wiTel xazad gasdevda udavo faqti, rom sabWoTa reJimis 70-wlian periodSi aTiaTasobiT adamiani saqarTveloSi, iseve, rogorc sabWoTa kavSiris sxva qveynebSi, gadaasaxles qonebis konfiskaciiT, bevri daxvrites da daapatimres. arsebobs uamravi dokumenti, rom represirebulebi da maTi STamomavlebi mravali wlis ganmavlobaSi cnobilni iyvnen rogorc samSoblos moRalateebis, mtris Svilebi. maT uqmnidnen sayofacxovrebo Tu sxva saxis problemebs, aferxebdnen swavlis, muSaobis, karieruli winsvlis procesSi. es ar iyo erTjeradad miyenebuli ziani, misi Sedegebi dResac mohyvebaT am adamianebs, radgan fsiqologiuri travma lamis genetikurad gadadis, rodesac mas aseTi masStabis represiebi udevs safuZvlad. cxadia, yvela es faqtori, jamSi, gansazRvravs moraluri zianis anazRaurebis sidides.
ukve karga xania, rac saqarTvelos parlamentma miiRo kanoni, romlis Tanaxmadac, represirebulTaTvis moraluri zianis anazRaurebasTan dakavSirebiT saxelmwifom aiRo maTTvis Sesabamisi Tanxis gacemis valdebuleba. wlebis ganmavlobaSi arkvevdnen am Tanxis odenobas da misi gacemis aucileblobas, gasces kidec kompensaciebi, Tumca, sabolood, maTTvis gamiznuli pensiebic da SeRavaTebic imdenad `dailia~, rom lamis gaqra da sapensio danamatad – 7 larad iqca.
swored am Temaze Seadgines peticia saqarTvelos parlamentSi Sesatanad sazogadoeba „memorialis“ wevrebma, romliTac sabWoTa kavSiris periodSi represirebulTa da maTi ojaxebis mimarT sapensio danamatis gazrdas moiTxoven. Tu ra molodini aqvT am kuTxiT da ras iTxoven damatebiT represirebulTa STamomavlebi, amaze da sxva sakiTxebze saubrobs „aWarasTan“ interviuSi arasamTavrobo organizacia „memorialis“ Tavmjdomare zurab zaqariaZe.
– saubris dasawyisisTvis mimovixiloT am organizaciis daarsebis mizani da funqciebi.
– aWaris „memoriali“ daarsda 1996 wels. me Tavad damixvrites babua, mamis mama. swored mama, Tomas zaqariaZe iyo am organizaciis pirveli xelmZRvaneli. is exmareboda represirebulebs da maTi ojaxis wevrebs sxvadasxva sakiTxis mogvarebaSi, pirvel rigSi ki dokumentebis, daxvretilTa Tu nawamebTa samarxebis aRmoCenaSi.
sxvaTa Soris, gazeT „aWaris“ redaqtoris ali samsonias damsaxureba iyo, rom 1997 wels, pirvelad beWdur mediaSi, gamoqveynda grifiT „sruliad arasaidumlod“ represirebulTa siebi. unda genaxaT acremlebuli Svilebi, SviliSvilebi, romlebmac arc ki icodnen, rom mama an babua nawamebi da daxvretili iyo.
– pirveli samarxi rodis aRmoaCineT?
– 2015 wels mivmarTeT xelvaCauris gamgeobas da maSindeli gamgeblis nadim varSaniZis brZanebiT, Camoyalibda „1937-38 ww udanaSaulod represirebulTa samarxebis moZiebis samuSao jgufi“, romelsac piradad vxelmZRvanelobdi. CemTan erTad aq muSaobdnen yofili mufTi beJan bolqvaZe, ebraelTa saTvistomos xelmZRvaneli emil krupniki, azerbaijanelTa saTvistomos xelmZRvaneli vidadi axundovi, mwerali ramaz surmaniZe, meriis TanamSromlebi da a. S. maSin xelvaCaurSi „memorialis“ koordinatoris mamuli gvianiZis wyalobiT, moviZieT mniSvnelovani mowme guram jixaZe, romelmac zustad migviTiTa xelvaCaurSi arsebul samarxze. iq 150 adamianis saZvale vnaxeT. meore saerTo saflavi iyo salibaurSi, lavrenti berias agarakad cnobil saxlSi, sadac uamravi gvirabi gadioda. iq, im uwyebis yofili dacvis ufrosma Tengiz qondariZem migvaswavla, sad unda gagveTxara. Turme Tavad monawileobda am gvirabebis amovsebaSi 1978 wels. salibaurSic uamravi gvamia Camarxuli. iq paranormaluri movlenebic xSirad aRiniSneba.
– dacvis ufrosma saidan gaigo am samarxis Sesaxeb?
– viRac kaci mivida masTan, uTxra, Tavad vmonawileobdi daxvretaSi, 50 kacs erT jerze vxvretdiT, romelTac Semdegi 50 kaci marxavda, Semdeg im 50-s vxvretdiTo da a.S. iq dRemde ismis RamRamobiT kvnesa, oxvra, xmebi.
– samarxebis gaxsna da gvamebis identificireba rogor moxda?
– Cven samarxebi ar gagvixsnia da gaTxrebi ar gviwarmoebia, radgan iq daxuruli samxedro zonaa. sul orjer var namyofi, rodesac jixaZe miviyvaneT da migviTiTa, sad iyo samarxi da sxdomis oqmSi avsaxeT, meored – `imedis~ televiziis JurnalistTan, goderZi SaraSiasTan erTad. samarxi daafiqsires telefilmSi „grifiT saidumlo“.
Zvlebis identificireba, dnm-is dadgena Zalian ZviradRirebuli procesia, romelsac saxelmwifos uSualo Careva da monawileoba sWirdeba. 2017 wels demokratiuli CarTulobis centrSi CavatareT Sexvedra diasporebTan, radgan samarxebSi sxvadasxva erovnebis, rwmenisa da aRmsareblobis adamianebia Camarxuli. Cven moviTxoveT samTavrobo komisiis Seqmna, romelic mxolod ori wlis Semdeg, anu 2019 wels Camoyalibda aWaris axlandeli mTavrobis Tavmjdomaris Tornike riJvaZis uSualo xelSewyobiT.
– realurad ra gaakeTa sazogadoeba „memorialma~?
– swored saqarTvelos „memorialis“ uSualo monawileobiT, 1997 wels parlamentma SeimuSava da miiRo kanoni politikurad represirebulTa farTomasStabiani socialuri dacvis Sesaxeb. cxadia, am procesSi Cvenc, aWaris sazogadoebac aqtiurad viyaviT CarTuli.
– amJamad ramdeni beneficiaria darCenili, vinc am kanoniT sargeblobs?
– 10 000 – saqarTvelos masStabiT. aqedan 2500 adamiania mxolod xelvaCaurSi. warmogidgeniaT, ramxela cifria? am tkivilis, uuflebobis, ganadgurebuli xalxisTvis vmuSaobT dRemde yovelgvari dafinansebis, grantebis gareSe. madloba minda gadavuxado axalgazrda iuristTa asociacias, romelic dRemde gverdSi gvidgas usasyidlod. Cven SevimuSaveT wesdeba, romlis mixedviTac politikur procesebSi monawileobac ki aRvkveTeT, rame rom ar daebralebinaT gamorCenis kuTxiT. me, rogorc SviliSvili, verafers viReb materialurs, ubralod, vexmarebi maT, visac uSualod Seexo represiebis usastikesi meqanizmi. sxvaTa Soris, mxolod xelvaCaurSia aRmarTuli represirebulTa xsovnis memoriali. maSin xelvaCauris municipalitetSi sazogadoebasTan urTierTobis ganyofilebaSi vmuSaobdi, romelsac xelmZRvanelobda giorgi TedoraZe. man mogvawoda samarxebze memorialis aRmarTvis idea. im adgilas 21 kviparozi davrgeT 9 aprils im 21-daRupulis xsovnis pativsacemad.
– memorialTan xSirad midixarT Tu rame konkretuli TariRis aRsaniSnavad?
– modiT, gadavTvaloT TariRebi – pirveli represiebi politikuri niSniT moxda 1921 wlis 25 Tebervals. Semdeg modis 9 aprili, Semdeg – 26 maisi da 22 ivlisi, represirebulTa xsovnis dRe, romelic daaarsa prezidentma 2020 wels. weliwadSi oTxjer mivagebT pativs am memorialTan daRupulebs.
– represirebulebi da maTi Svilebi ras iReben?
-SevardnaZis periodSi saqarTveloSi mcxovrebi 10 aTasamde represirebuli omis veteranebs gauTanabres, Tumca axla 7 lars iReben sapensio danamatad.
– 7 lari yovelTviurad – ra aris es, simboluri aqcia Tu realuri fuli?
– es 7 lari ganisazRvra 1992 wels, rodesac saqarTvelos parlamentma miiRo kanoni politikuri represiebis msxverplTaTvis socialuri daxmarebis Sesaxeb. maSin masSi iyo Cadebuli socialuri paketebi, SeRavaTebi wylis, gazis, Suqis, mgzavrobis Tu mkurnalobis xarjebze. rogorc giTxariT, es adamianebi gaaTanabres samamulo omis veteranebTan da sakmaod normaluri SeRavaTebiT sargeblobdnen manam, sanam ar movida saTaveSi saakaSvili da ar gaauqma es socialuri SeRavaTebi, Tumca, rac unda ucnaurad mogeCvenoT, 7 lari datoves.
– nuTu protesti aravin ganacxada?
– rogor ara, es iyo maTi mxridan arakonstituciuri qmedeba, radgan konstituciaSi weria, rom ar SeiZleba iseTi sakanonmdeblo aqtis miReba, romelic gaauaresebs adamianis mdgomareobas. amasTan dakavSirebiT guram soseliam (saqarTvelos „memorialis~ Tavmjdomare) Seitana sarCeli sakonstitucio sasamarTloSi, mimarTa parlaments, gadaxedon represirebulTa e.w. kompensacias da 7 laris nacvlad maTac, iseve rogorc omis veteranebs, mieceT 44 lari, magram amaod.
– 44 lari cota araa?
– geTanxmebiT, arc esaa didi Tanxa, magram arsebuls jobia. aucilebelia am Temis farTo sazogadoebis samsjavroze gamotana. Tanac, isic unda gaiTvaliswinon, 2003 wlidan dRemde, ramdeni weli gavida da is sxvaoba daurigon am xalxs, maT Soris, imaT Svilebsac, vinc am periodSi gardaicvala. aseve, saqarTvelos „memorialma“ gaagzavna werili parlamentSi, romelSic iTxovda, rom yvela represirebuls miakuTvnon politikurad devnilis statusi, imis miuxedavad, Tu romeli mTavrobis mier iyo represirebuli. 200 adamians marTlac mieniWa politpatimris statusi, magram aranair kompensaciaze saubaric ar aris. yovelive es kanonSi unda gaiweros, sxva mxriv samarTlianoba ver izeimebs.
– axla ras iTxovT?
– isev da isev, im 44 lars. ar aris did Tanxaze saubari, radgan mxolod 10 000 adamiania am statusiT, Tanac is 7 lari xom eZlevaT? daamaton 37 lari da Tanxa Seivseba. viTxovT, saqarTvelos miliardian biujetSi gamoinaxos TveSi 370 000 lari, rom aRdges samarTali. imedi gvaqvs, mTavroba gaiTvaliswinebs aTasobiT moqalaqis interesebs da daakmayofilebs Cvens moTxovnas.
– samomavlod ra gegmebi gaqvT?
– sxdomebis oqmebSi avsaxeT es gegmebi, romelic nawilobriv Sesrulda. kerZod, viTxovdiT specialuri samTavrobo komisiis Seqmnas arqeologebisa da geologebis CarTulobiT, gaTxrebs – yvela wesisa da rigis dacviT. komisia Seiqmna kidec aWaris jandacvis ministris zaal miqelaZis xelZRvanelobiT. pirveli sxdoma Catarda 2019 wlis 1 maiss, romelsac eswrebodnen eparqiidan, samufTodan da sxv. Tumca, aqve minda aRvniSno, rom es saqme iseT xarjebs moiTxovs da iseT dafinansebas, Tu centraluri xelisufleba ar Caeria, adgilobrivi ZalebiT verafers gavxdebiT. imedis sxivi ukve gamoCnda batoni Tornikes wyalobiT da darwmunebuli var, pandemiis damarcxebis Semdeg, samarxebis sakiTxsac movagvarebT, neStebis identificirebasac da maT wesisa da rigis mixedviT dakrZalvas. gverdiT gvidgas meufe dimitric, romelic yvelgan gzas gvikvlevs da gvmfarvelobs.
aqve minda aRvniSno, rom 2001 wels sofel aWariswyalSi axalgazrdebma moindomes eklesiis aSeneba. mamaCemis, jumber (Tomas) zaqariaZis xelmZRvanelobiT (manve gamoyo sakuTari nakveTi), farTo sazogadoebis TanadgomiT, aTiaTasobiT represirebulTa sulTa sacxoneblad, 6 weliwadSi aSenda yovladwminda RvTismSoblis iveris karibWis xatis saxelobis taZari. moZRvari mama ioseb mamulaZe axlac iq qadagebs, jvars wers, wess ugebs, naTlavs mrevls da morwmuneebTan erTad loculobs warsulSi Cakargul adamianTa sulebisTvis.
