,,უმრავლესობამ მოსახლეობა მოატყუა, რადგან პრინციპულად განსხვავებული პროექტი დაამტკიცა”
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aWaris umaRlesi sabWos mier saarCevno sistemis nawilobriv Secvlas principulad ewinaaRmdegebodnen radikaluri opoziciis warmomadgenlebi, Tumca amaod. ukve gadawyvetilia – rogorc saqarTvelos parlamentis, ise aWaris umaRlesi sabWos arCevnebi sruliad proporciuli wesiT 2024 wels Catardeba da ara 2020 wels, rogorc es sayovelTao-saxalxo ganxilvebis dros mosaxleobas SesTavazes 2019 wels. im Sexvedrebidan erT welze naklebi gavida. sazogadoebisTvis gansaxilvelad wardgenili proeqti Seicvala da srulad proporciul sistemaze gadasvla kidev oTxi wliT gadaido. axla opozicia ambobs, rom umravlesobam mosaxleoba moatyua, radgan principulad gansxvavebuli proeqti daamtkica.
mogexsenebaT, umaRles sabWoSi 2020 wlis 1 ivliss pirveli mosmena gaimarTa da TxuTmetma wevrma kanonSi aRniSnuli cvlilebebis ganxorcielebas xma misca. meore da mesame mosmenebze igive ganmeorda. opoziciam ganacxada, rom arCevnebis Sereuli sistemiT Catarebas mxars ar uWerda da boikotis reJimSi gadavida. boikotis kidev erT mizezad opozicia 8 martis SeTanxmebis Seusruleblobas asaxelebs (saubaria giorgi ruruas gaTavisuflebaze. opozicia miiCnevs, rom is politpatimaria da sxva dakavebulebTan erTad unda gaeTavisuflebinaT).
am sakiTxze gTavazobT aWaris umaRlesi sabWos deputatis, fraqcia `erTiani nacionaluri moZraobis~ Tavmjdomare elguja bagrationis Tvalsazriss
– batono elguja, ratom ar mogewonaT aWaris umaRlesi sabWos saarCevno sistemis cvlileba, rogorc viciT, swored amisTvis ibrZodiT sakmaod didi xnis ganmavlobaSi?
– diax, vibrZodiT, Tanac Zalian aqtiurad. gavixsenoT Tundac 20 ivnisis monapovari, rodesac sisxliT mivaRwieT SeTanxmebas, rom proporciul saarCevno siste-maze gadavsuliyaviT. Tumca `qarTulma ocnebam~ kidev erTxel gadaagdo qarTveli xalxi da danapirebi ar Seasrula.
– nawilobriv xom mainc Sesrulda es danapirebi?
– es moxda saerTaSoriso organizaciebisa da qarTveli xalxis zewoliT da ara `qarTuli ocnebis~ surviliT. 8 martis SeTanxmeba mxolod opoziciis damsaxurebaa. maSin gadawyda, rom es arCevnebi am sistemiT Catardeboda, Tumca isic kargad gaxsovT, rom SeTanxmeba Sedgeboda ori muxlisgan, erTi iyo: saarCevno sistema, meore – politpatimrebis gaTavisufleba.
– aWaris umaRlesi sabWo am SeTanxmebaSi ar monawileobda da ratom sTxovT pasuxs sakuTar kolegebs ruruas gaTavisuflebasTan dakavSirebiT?
– aWaraSi iyo gansakuTrebuli darRvevebi da amitom ganvacxadeT boikoti kenWisyrisas. Tqven iciT, rom sakonstitucio cvlilebebi moiTxovs saxalxo ganxilvebs, romelic Catarda kidec SarSan, Tumca iq ganixiles proporciul saarCevno sistemaze gadasvla da ara – Sereulze. im periodSi gaviareT yvela aucilebeli procedura. darCenili iyo mxolod sxdoma, sadac unda damtkicebuliyo es cvlileba. im periodSi qveynis mTavarma sakanonmdeblo organom es kanoni ar miiRo, Caagdo da Sesabamisad, aWaraSic ar moxda cvlileba avtonomiuri respublikis konstituciaSi. yvelaferi SeaCeres da cvlilebaTa paketi Semodes Taroze. rodesac parlamenti gadavida Sereul saarCevno sistemaze, umaRlesi sabWos umravlesobam, yovelgvari saxalxo ganxilvebis gareSe, kanonis darRveviT daamtkica saarCevno Sereuli sistema 18/3-ze.
– boikotis reJimSi karga xania imyofebiT, jer kidev am sistemis damtkicebamde. ratom?
– boikoti gamovacxadeT maSinve, rogorc ki ar gavida proporciuli saarCevno sistema parlamentSi. Tumca 8 martis SeTanxmebis Semdeg, daviwyeT muSaoba xelisuflebasTan erTad saarCevno kanonze. vinaidan SeTanxmeba nawilobriv Sesrulda da rurua darCa sapatimroSi, rogorc xedavT, mTavrobam gadaagdo ara mxolod opozicia, aramed is saerTaSoriso organizaciebic, romlebic mxarSi udgas Cvens qveyanas rogorc ekonomikuri, ise politikuri procesebis marTvaSi. amis Semdeg ar mimaCnia marTebulad maTTan TanamSromloba.
– Tqveni oponentebi ki Tvlian, rom `nacionalur moZraobas~ xels ar aZlevda araTu proporciuli sistema, Sereulic ki da amitom acxadeben boikots. . .
– Cven boikoti gamovacxadeT imitom, rom adgilobrivma sakanonmdeblo organom ver miiRo damoukidebeli gadawyvetileba da ver SeZlo srul proprociul sistemaze gadasvla imis miuxedavad, rom gavlili gvqonda yvela aucilebeli procedura. survili rom ar gvqonoda, ar miviRebdiT monawileobas am ganxilvebSi da ar miviyvandiT saqmes bolo wertilamde. rac Seexeba politpatimrebis gaTavisuflebas, saqme ar aris mxolod saxel-gvarSi _ maincdamainc ruruas gaTavisuflebaSi. ubralod, misi sapatimroSi datovebiT, xelisuflebam kidev erTxel daadastura, rom arCevnebis Catarebas kvlav daWerebiT apirebs, gayalbebiT, mosyidviT, daSinebiT Tu Zalis gamoyenebiT. es yvelaferi damafiqrebelia da gasaanalizebeli. Tanac, arc is dagaviwydeT, rom msoflio pandemiis gamocxadebisTanave gamovediT boikotis reJimidan da xelisuflebas Tanadgoma SevTavazeT, vuTxariT, gadagvewyvita saWirboroto sakiTxebi da krizisi erTad dagveZlia, erTad SegvemuSvebina biujetis koreqtirebis sakiTxebi, rac gamoiyvanda aWaris mosaxleobas SeWirvebuli mdgomareobidan. pasuxad miviReT, rom maT ukeT ician, ra sWirdeba mosaxleobas da erTi TeTriTac ar Seimcires dafinanseba.
– Tu SeiZleba dagvikonkreteT, ras gulisxmobT?
– im zedmet adgilebs da dafinansebebs, romlebic sruliadac ar aris aucilebeli kanonmdeblebisTvis. ra saWiroa damatebiT Seqmnili is ori fraqcia, romelic umaRles sabWoSi aqvs `qarTul ocnebas~. sami aqvs, erTi ar eyofa? Seqmnili aqvT imitom, rom miiRon yovelwliurad damatebiT 100 000 lari, avtomanqana, zedmeti sawvavi, sxva xarjebi da a.S. yvelaferi amis SezRudva da gauqmeba ar moindomes, rom gamoTavisuflebuli Tanxebi moxmareboda mosaxleobas msoflio pandemiis am urTules periodSi. Sesabamisad, sadac xalxis xma, problemebi ar esmiT am adamianebs, azrs kargavs maTTan TanamSromlobis yvela mcdeloba da amitom varCieT boikoti.
– boikotis reJimSi darCenas xom ar apirebT arCevnebis drosac?
– ara, Cven monawileobas miviRebT yvela saxis arCevnebSi, rogoric unda iyos. garwmunebT, opozicia moigebs am arCevnebs, miuxedavad imisa, rom Cven araerTi siuJeti vnaxeT, rogor amzadeben zonder-jgufebs arCevnebis gasayalbeblad da sarezervo fondidan uricxaven Tanxebs, maSin, rodesac mosaxleoba saxlebSi hyavT Caketili ulukmapurod.
– zonderbrigadebze gaTvlas aslan abaSiZisa da mixeil saakaSvilis xelisuflebis dros ufro akeTebdnen. maSin namdvili terori iyo nebismier, Tundac sruliad uniaTo winaaRmdegobaze. . .
– rac Seexeba aslan abaSiZisa da `nacionaluri moZraobis~ Secdomebs, ukve araerTxel vimeoreb: warsuli Secdomebis ganmeoreba ar gvepatieba, am Secdomebze unda viswavloT da ar davuSvaT igive scenariT arCevnebis Catareba. mas Semdeg, rac movida saTaveSi `qarTuli ocneba~, sul Zvel Secdomebze saubrobs da imagrebs poziciebs. gavigeT, gaviareT, gavaanalizeT, rodemde unda vicxovroT warsuliT. axali era, axali perspeqtivebi aqvs dRes Cvens qveyanas, romelic demokratiuli procesebiT unda gavajeroT da ara warsulze agebuli braldebebiT. amiT ras, an vis umtkiceben? sakuTar bnel zraxvebs niRbaven. dRes SeuZlebelia televiziebis daxurviT, adamianebis daSinebiT da daWeriT SeaCero demokratia da moigo arCevnebSi umravlesoba.
– Tqven piradad vis xedavT xelisuflebaSi? migaCniaT, rom mixeil saakaSvili ukeTesi gamosavalia?
– qveynis saTaveSi ar unda davuSvaT partia, romelic CrdiloeTisken iyureba. ruseTTan dabruneba waSlis Cveni eris momavals, mis TviTmyofadobas. saqarTvelos mTavrobaSi mova is Zala, romelsac xalxi airCevs, iqneba es `nacionaluri moZraoba~ Tu sxva partia, amas ar aqvs mniSvneloba. arCevani unda gakeTdes konkretuli programebis mixedviT, sadac gawerili iqneba, rogor gamoiyvans esa Tu is politikuri Zala qveyanas krizisidan. Cven dRes skamebis gadanawilebiT ar varT dakavebulni, vmuSaobT programaze, rogor vuSveloT saqarTvelos, rogor gamoviyvanoT gaWirvebidan qarTveli xalxi. garwmunebT, saamisod adamianuri resursebic gagvaCnia da materialuric. SevZlebT, qveyana swor relsebze davayenoT da ekonomikuri progresisken waviyvanoT.
– rogor gesaxebaT momavali xelisufleba, umaRlesi sabWo?
– Cemi gadasaxedidan, es iqneba ara erTpartiuli, aramed mravalpartiuli organo, romelic SeZlebs demokratiulad marTos qveyana ise, rom ar dairRves mosaxleobis uflebebi da urTierTSeTanxmebis safuZvelze gamoiyvans saqarTvelos am saSineli gaWirvebidan.
visargebleb SemTxveviT da aWaris mosaxleobas vetyvi, rom evropuli da amerikuli Tanamegobroba, romelic Cven mxars gviWers, ar dauSvebs biZina ivaniSvilis kvlav gamarjvebas. Cveni partia Zalas ikrebs da garwmunebT, isev mova qveynis saTaveSi gaerTianebul opoziciasTn erTad.
– maSinac gaerTianda opozicia, rodesac mixeil saakaSvili iyo saTaveSi, yvelaferi analogiuri scenariT viTardeba, raRac mojadoebuli wre ikvreba, qarTveli politikosebi gaTelil bilikebs ubrundebian. . .
– 2012 wels 6 partia gaerTianda `qarTuli ocnebis~ irgvliv, axla ki yvela opoziciuri partiaa gaerTianebuli, isinic ki, romlebic maSin ar iyvnen. dRes, biZina ivaniSvilis gverdiT ar darCa arc erTi opoziciuri Zala, Tu ar CavTvliT `patriotTa alianss~, romelic ruseTidan finansdeba, iseve, rogorc Tavad biZina. yvela sxva – erTianad acxadebs, rom `qarTuli ocneba~ unda wavides xelisuflebidan, radgan angrevs qveyanas da auaresebs qarTveli xalxis isedac arasaxarbielo mdgomareobas.
