,,იმდენად ,,მაჟორიტარული ფსიქოლოგია” ჩამომიყალიბდა, რომ უკვე ავტომატურად, პირველ რიგში, საზოგადოებასა და ჩემს ხალხზე ვფიქრობ”
ირმა ცეცხლაძე: 27 48 93 –
`qarTulma ocnebam~ ukve warudgina sazogadoebas maJoritarobis axali kandidatebi, xolo jer kidev moqmedi maJoritarebi, vadis amowurvamde, prezentaciebs amzadeben, raTa yofil amomrCevlebs angariSi Caabaron gaweuli muSaobis Sesaxeb. gTavazobT saqarTvelos parlamentis vice-spikeris, xelvaCauris maJoritari deputatis ilia nakaSiZis intervius
– warmatebulma eqimma ratom gadawyviteT politikaSi wasvla?
– rogorc iciT, aslan abaSiZis dros ukve viyavi politikaSi, baTumis sakrebulos Tavmjdomaris posti meWira, Tumca maSin, Cemi profesiuli statusis da aqtivobis SenarCuneba ufro ioli iyo, vidre parlamentSi yofnisas. 2004-dan 2012 wlamde, rogorc me, ise Cemma ojaxma ganicada Zlieri zewola saakaSvilis xelisuflebisgan. me saqarTveloSi arc davbadebulvar da arc gavzrdilvar. samive Zma CamovediT ukrainidan, saubaric ki miWirda mSobliur enaze, magram qarTveli var suliT xorcamde. Cems pirdapir movaleobad CavTvale, yvelaferi gamekeTebina, oRond is dro, rac iyo, arasodes dabrunebuliyo saqarTveloSi. es Zalian Zlieri motivacia iyo, ris gamoc droebiT Sevw-yvite samedicino praqtika da movedi parlamentSi, raTa sakuTari xalxis xma mimewvdina axali xelisuflebisaTvis.
– radgan warsuls SevexeT, Tu SeiZleba gviambeT, qarTuli ojaxi rogor aRmoCndiT ukrainaSi?
– mama giorgi nakaSiZe (qedis raionidan) samxedro eqimi iyo, klinikosi. Tavidan Tbilisis saxelmwifo samedicino institutSi swavlobda, Semdeg kuibiSevis samedicino institutSi gadaiyvanes da pirvelive ganawilebiT moxvda monRoleTSi, Semdeg – CrdiloeT yazaxeTSi, sadac Seqmna ojaxi, daqorwinda maxinjaurel CijavaZis qalze da. . . gavCndi me. mama rkinigzis jarebSi msaxurobda da wlis ganmavlobaSi lamis 8 Tve saxlSi ar iyo. maSin Sendeboda `transsibiri~, `bami~ da a.S. Zalian kargi eqimi iyo da Cems profesiul CamoyalibebaSi didi roli Seasrula misi gamocdilebis gaziarebam.
– araerTxel aRniSneT, rom parlamentarobis gamo samedicino praqtikas veRar eweodiT. pacientebma rogor daTmes sayvareli eqimi?
– praqtikul saqmianobas Tavi davanebe. Tumca akademiuri nawili davitove. marTalia, miWirda SeTavseba, magram sxva gza ar mqonda. parlamentaroba profesia ar aris, ufro sazogadoebrivi datvirTvaa, romelic did dros moiTxovs, radgan aq ar aris ganakveTebi, muSaob 24-saaTian reJimSi. iyo parlamentari, niSnavs Tavdauzogavad emsaxuro xalxs, im adamianebs, romlebmac ndobis mandati Cagabares da Sengan yuradRebas, mzrunvelobas, Suamavlobas elodebian. principSi, igive datvriTva aqvs medikossac. ver mivatovebdi im pacientebs, visac Cemi imedi hqondaT, im axalgazrda kolegebs, romlebsac darigeba sWirdebodaT. dRemde arian avadmyofebi, romlebic mxolod me mendobian da ver gavucrueb am ndobas. amitom, gansazRvrul dros vatarebdi konsultaciebs, ra Tqma unda, uangarod, yovelgvari anazRaurebis gareSe, radgan parlamentars praqtikuli muSaobis ufleba ar aqvs.
– ojaxis wevrebs ufro romel ampluaSi moswonxarT – eqimis Tu deputatis?
– cxadia, ojaxis wevrebisTvis didad sasurveli ar aris Cemi politikaSi yofna, radgan meti datvirTva maqvs, rogorc emociuri, ise fizikuri. met energias xarjav da nakleb yurdaRebas uTmob ojaxs. Tumca, iyo ramdenime SemTxveva, rodesac Cemi avtoritetiT da statusiT SevZeli samSobloSi damebrunebina is qarTvelebi, romlebic politikurad daZabuli viTarebis gamo (2004-2012 wlebi) ver bedavdnen Camosvlas, daSinebulni iyvnen. maT garantad davudeqi, Suamdgomloba gavuwie da. . . maxsovs, Cemma ufrosma vaJma miTxra `mama, mxolod am xalxis madli geyofa, marto amad Rirda Seni parlamentaroba~. simarTle giTxraT, Svilis naTqvamSi yvelaze metad is gamixarda, rom isic CemsaviT fiqrobs: mTavaria, emsaxuro Sens xalxs, sazogadoebas, Sens qveyanas. es yvelaze didi saqmea isedac mcire qarTvelobisTvis.
– deputatobis vada gewurebaT, romel saqmeebs gaixsenebT, romelmac kvali datova Tqvens da garSemomyofTa cxovrebaSi?
– Tqvenis nebarTviT, Cems saqmianobas sam nawilad davyof: 1. sakanonmdeblo da samuSao Sexvedrebi seriozul problematikasTan dakavSirebiT; 2. municipaluri problemebi; 3. pirovnuli, rodesac amomrCeveli piradad gxvdeba da saubrobs Tavis Tu ojaxis pirad problemebze da gTxovs daxmarebas. pirvel SemTxvevaSi, yvelaze seriozul warmatebad mimaCnia `miwis organuli kanonis~ sistemuri amoqmedeba, romelic gulisxmobs nakveTebis martivad, ufasod aRiarebas da dakanonebas. am kuTxiT, biZina ivaniSvilma seriozulad damiWira mxari. sxvaTa Soris, kanonis asamoqmedeblad 2 weli dagvWirda, ar vaxmaurebdi misi SemuSavebis process, rom winaaRmdegobebi ar Segvxvedroda. madloba RmerTs, yvelaferi kargad dasrulda. am kanonis meSveobiT dagrovili problemebis 70% gadawydeba. Tanac rodesac miwas yvela gadaiformebs, es realur gavlenas moaxdens Cvens erovnul ekonomikaze da ramdenime weliwadSi am kuTxiT gaRebuli Zalisxmeva dagvibrundeba seriozuli sabiujeto zrdiT.
– mTa mtiralas sakiTxi?
– es ufro emociur sakiTxad SeiZleba CaiTvalos, radgan mtiralas sarekreacio zonad gamocxadeba sasixaruloa adgilobrivi mosaxleobisTvis. jer amas didi rezonansi ar aqvs, radgan tenderSi gamarjvebuli kompania ar gamJRavnebula. aqve minda aRvniSno, rom mniSvnelovani nabiji iyo maWaxlis xeobaSi mTis kanonis amoqmedeba, rac, Tamamad SemiZlia vTqva, piradad Cemi damsaxurebaa. mTis kanonis kidev 7 sofelSi asamoqmedeblad vibrZvi, seriozuli mxardaWerac maqvs da minda, sanam parlamentSi moRvaweobas davasruleb, es saCuqaric gavukeTo Cems xalxs.
– municipaluri kuTxiT ra gaakeTeT?
– sakmaod bevri sakanonmdeblo aqti miviReT regionaluri ganviTarebisTvis. aqve minda aRvniSno, rom municipalitetebs ufleba miecaT Seqmnan sakuTari avtosatransporto samsaxurebi, rac xels Seuwyobs mosaxleobis keTildReobas, rigi problemebis swrafad da umtkivneulod mogvarebas.
– eqimebs ar gCveviaT saidumlos gamJRavneba. . .
– diax, yvelafers ver da ar vityvi. ZiriTadad mommarTavdnen umweobis, sneulebis, msjavrdebulTa saqmeebis mosagvareblad. uamrav pirovnebas davexmare. swored am kuTxiT mimaCnia maJoritarobis instituti gamarTlebulad, Tumca pirdapirproporciulsac Tavisi dadebiTi mxareebi aqvs. ufro progresulia da demokratiuli.
– ratom maincdamainc `qarTuli ocneba~, arasodes gagCeniaT sxva partiaSi gadasvlis survili?
– imdenad didi stresi miviReT 2004 wlis Semdeg me da Cemi ojaxis wevrebma, rom mamam isic ki miTxra, Zalian Sevcdi, saqarTveloSi rom CamogiyvaneTo. samive Zma ukve sabuTebs vaformebdiT ucxoeTSi gadasaxvewad, roca gamoCnda `qarTuli ocneba~. simarTle giTxraT, is imedis erTaderTi sxivi iyo im ukuneTSi. winasaarCevno periodSi ise gveSinoda, raime ar damarTnoda ivaniSvils. . . gaxsovT, albaT, ras ar uwyobdnen, ra problemebs axvevdnen Tavs, magram ufalma daifara saqarTvelo da batoni biZina. aq politikur principebze ki ara, szogadoebis Tavisuflebaze iyo laparaki. maSin miviCnie Tavi valdebulad, rom mis gverdiT davmdgariyavi da amayi var, rom biZina ivaniSvilma mxarSi amomiyena.
– manamde piradad icnobdiT biZina ivaniSvils, Tu. . .
– ara, magram minda aRvniSno, rom Cemi filosofia Zalian axlos dgas misi pirovnebis msoflmxedvelobasTan. pirvel rigSi, igi humanuri, bunebis moyvaruli, progresuli ideebis matarebeli, demokratiuli principebis adamiania, Zalian sxarti, teqnokratiuli azrovneba aqvs. mixaria, rom es 4 weli viyavi baton biZinasTan erT gundSi, bevri ram viswavle misgan. aseTi mecenati saqarTvelos jer ar hyolia.
– parlamentaris gadasaxedidan, yvelaze metad ra uWirs saqarTvelos da qarTvel xalxs?
– pirveli problemaa Zalian rTuli geopolitikuri viTareba, romelic Cvenze maincdamainc ar aris damokidebuli, magram valdebulni varT, uaxloes momavalSi CamovayaliboT mdgradi, pragmatuli, gaTvlili, seriozuli sagareo politika, romlis meSveobiTac SevZlebT sakuTari xalxis, qveynis interesebis dacvas da win wamowevas. xalxma mxolod axla gaiTavisa, ramdeni davkargeT, Tavis droze emociebs rom avyeviT da ase ar moviqeciT. did problemas gviqmnis jer kidev ganuviTarebeli ekonomika, romelic sruliad ganadgurda sabWoeTis daSlis Semdeg. maSin davkargeT rogorc materialuri bazebi, ise kontaqtebi, gasaRebis bazrebi, romelTac axla didi ZalisxmeviT veZebT. wamogvewia kidev erTi problema – ganaTleba. bevri ramis gakeTeba SegviZlia, magram arc codna da arc unar-Cvevebi ar gagvaCnia. axla miviReT sokoebiviT amosuli im `universitetebis~ gaxsnis savalalo Sedegi, 90-ianebSi lamis yvela rom wagvleka. am fonze, batoni biZinas 1 miliardi evro, romelic quTaisis saerTaSoriso universitetSi gadaricxa, 10-15 weliwadSi, qarTul ekonomikas 100 miliardis efeqts miscems. marTlac, seriozuli Tanxebi Caido ganaTlebaSi. metsac getyviT, rodesac infrastruqturul proeqtebs davasrulebT (avtobanebs, trasebs), iqidan gamoTavisuflebul Tanxebsac ganaTlebisken mivmarTavT. amis valdebuleba Cven ukve aviReT. aqve minda ganvacxado, rom seriozulad vafinansebT socialur sferos, radgan mowyvladi jgufi bevria saqarTveloSi. adamiani gemrielad ver SeWams, Tu gverdiT mSieri udgas, arada, gvinda, yvelam Rirseulad, komfortulad vicxovroT Cvens lamaz, guluxv qveyanaSi. Sevecade CamomeTvala is, rac yvelaze metad uWirs saqarTvelos. amis miuxedavad, mivdivarT win da kargi maCveneblebic gvaqvs. es kovidis msoflio pandemiamac daadastura – Cveni xelisufleba yvelaze mdgradi, unariani, Sromisnayofieri da iniciativiani aRmoCnda saerTaSoriso masStabiT, Tumca pandemiis SeCerebas ver movaxerxebdiT, rom ar gvqonoda sazogadoebis usazRvro ndoba da Tanadgoma.
– mainc ratom unda avirCioT ukve mesamed `qarTuli ocneba~, es xom ewinaaRmdegeba demokratiis ZiriTad principebs?
– es yvelaze aqtualuri SekiTxvaa. `qarTulma ocnebam~ Tavisi mosvliT saTave daudo saqarTveloSi yvelaze mZlavri demokratiuli principebis damkvidrebas. mmarTvelobis 8 wlis ganmavlobaSi sakuTari xelwerac ki SeimuSava. yvelam kargad viciT, risken miviltviT, ra gvsurs da ris damkvidrebas vcdilobT saqarTveloSi: Zlieri ekonomikis, saerTaSoriso standartebis infrastruqturis, maRali donis ganaTlebisa da socialuri proeqtebis farTo speqtris. yvelaferi es gadabmulia erTmaneTze. Cven aRebul kurss ar vuRalatebT. darwmunebuli var, movaxerxebT, rom gvqondes seriozuli upiratesoba xmebis raodenobiT.
– batono ilia, rogor fiqrobT, partiuli siiT isev movxdebiT parlamentSi?
– am sakiTxs cota filosofiurad aRviqvam: sadac partia CaTvlis saWirod, iq viqnebi.
– aWaris jandacvis ministri maJoritar deputatad iyris kenWs. Tqven xom ar apirebT aqeT wamosvlas – erT warmatebul eqims meore Caenacvleboda. . .
– zaal miqelaZe marTlac saxalxo ministri iyo. man iseT simaRleze aswia Tamasa, rom Tuki partiam saministroSi gamomiSva, Sevecdebi, igi ar davce. Cemi samaJoritaro olqi gauqmda, SeuerTda maRalmTian aWaras, arada, kidev bevri sakiTxi darCa mosagvarebeli. iq anzor bolqvaZe iyris kenWs. darwmunebuli var, gaimarjvebs. me mxarSi davudgebi, sadac unda viyo. aseve, gpirdebiT, rom viaqtiureb jandacvis sferoSic. iciT, rom jer kidev gasarkvevia tuberkulozis da respublikuri saavadmyofoebis momavali. imedi maqvs, Cems pozicias gaiTvaliswinebs xelmZRvaneloba. imdenad `maJoritaruli fsiqologia~ Camomiyalibda, rom ukve avtomaturad, pirvel rigSi sazogadoebasa da Cems xalxze vfiqrob (eRimeba).
– maJoritarobis axal kandidatebs rogor SeafasebdiT da saerTod, ras iZleva maJoritaruli sistema?
– iciT, rodesac partiuli sistemebi da partiebi normalurad Camoyalibebuli ar aris da Sen anadgureb maJoritarul nawils, maSin ras sTavazob mosaxleobas, romelic maJoritaris meSveobiT sakmaod bevr saqmes agvarebda? praqtikulad, amomrCevels operatiul saSualebas ukargav, daukavSirdes, magaliTad, deputat nakaSiZes, romelic mis uflebebs daicavs aRmasrulebeli xelisuflebis da sakanonmdeblo doneze. rac Seexeba kandidatebs – kargi arCevania. darwmunebuli var, rac Cven mougvarebeli dagvrCa, ver movaswariT, davgegmeT da Sesasrulebelia, isini yvelafers umaRles doneze gaakeTeben da Tavis sityvasac ityvian politikur sarbielze.
aqve vsargeblob SemTxveviT da minda vusurvo warmatebebi qarTuli politikuri speqtris im partiebs, romlis xelmZRvanelobac fiqrobs saqarTvelos da xalxis momavalze da ara sakuTar politikur renomeze, ambiciur, qveynis damangrevel gegmebze.
