,,რომ არ დავეხმაროთ, იტყვიან, არ ეხმარებიან და ხალხი ამ მდგომარეობაში დატოვესო”
ირმა ცეცხლაძე: 27 48 93 –
demokratiuli mmarTveloba saqarTvelos yvelaze Zvirfasi monapovaria, ramac qveyana regionSi gamoarCia da mas evropuli da evroatlantikuri integraciis SesaZlebloba misca. am monapovris dakargva ganuzomlad didi danaklisi iqneba. Zalian mniSvnelovania, rom qveynis momavali politikuri cxovreba stabilurad warimarTos da ufro konstruqciuli politikuri garemo Seiqmnas, sadac konkurentebs Tanabar pirobebSi paeqrobisa da moqalaqeTa interesebis amsaxveli, gansxvavebuli politikuri xedvebis warmodgenis saSualeba eqnebaT.
arada, winasaarCevno bataliebi dawyebulia – opoziciuri partiebi mmarTvel partias erTxmad deben brals arCevnebis gayalbebis mcdelobaSi, administraciuli resursebis gamoyenebaSi, amomrCevlis mosyidvasa da sxv.
ras fiqroben amaze `qarTuli ocnebis~ wevrebi, CvenTan saubrobs aWaris umaRlesi sabWos fraqcia `qarTuli ocneba – maJoritarebis~ Tavmjdomare ilia verZaZe.
– batono ilia, ra mdgomareobaa qveynis politikur cxovrebaSi am etapze, ras akeTebs `qarTuli ocneba~ winasaarCevno kampaniis stabilur viTarebaSi warmarTvisTvis?
– am kiTxvaze standartul pasuxs gagcemT – qveyanaSi arsebuli mdgomareobis gaTvaliswinebiT, saarCevno Stabic da partiis wevrebic vemzadebiT arCevnebisTvis. yvelaferi mzadaa qveynis yvela saarCevno ubanze anu is, rac xelisuflebas exeba. vapirebT aqtiuri da jansaRi winasaarCevno kampania vawarmooT.
– ukve agorda axali koronavirusis meore talRa. opoziciis gancxadebiT, es aris dadgmuli speqtakli, romelic xelisuflebas sWirdeba arCevnebis SezRudulad CatarebisTvis, riTac ufro iolad SeZlebs kenWisyris Sedegebis gayalbebas.
– faqtobrivad, opozicia mxolod destruqciuli gancxadebebiT aris dakavebuli, Tumca rogorc ki CaeZiebiT da sakiTxis axsnas mosTxovT, maSinve iwyeba areuli saubrebi. realurad, statistikaze dayrdnobiT keTdeba is SezRudvebi, razec axla davoben. Seviwroebad rom ar miiRon, politikur aqciebs da Tavyrilobebs aravin zRudavs, agreTve, karantinis vada 8 dRemde daswies da Tuki Cveni moqalaqeebi pasuxismgeblobiT moekidebian rekomendaciebs, am 50 dReSi, rac arCevnebamde darCa, es talRac gadaivlis, xolo karantinSi moxvedrilebi, SeZleben iqidan gamosvlas, ase rom, opozicia Tuki marTlaa dainteresebuli arCevnebis stabilur, jansaR garemoSi CatarebiT, janmos da jandacvis saministros mier dawesebuli wesebis gaTvaliswineba mosTxovos sakuTar momxreebs da mouwodos mosaxleobas higienis wesebis dacva da pirbadis tareba sazogadoebrivi TavSeyris adgilebSi. moiqces ise, rogorc Cven, gaufrTxildnen mosaxleobis janmrTelobas da Sedegad miiReben jansaR garemos arCevnebis Casatareblad. arada, isini swored sapirispiros sCadian, Tesaven panikas da eZaxian speqtakls msoflio pandemias, riTac kidev ufro amZafreben viTarebas. zogierTs marTla aRar sjera virusis arsebobis da amiT riskis qveS ayenebs rogorc garSemo myofT, ise sakuTar Tavsac da ojaxebsac. aravis unda pandemiis momZlavreba, radgan es niSnavs dasnebovnebas, janmrTelobis riskis qveS dayenebas, sikvdilianobis matebas. rac unda opoziciurad iyo xelisuflebisadmi ganwyobili, romeli WkuaTmyofeli moisurvebs msgavss sakuTari xalxisTvis? magram albaT sWirdebaT sakuTari momxreebis SecdomaSi Sesayvanad da maTTan qulebis dasawerad. ar vici, sxva ra unda vTqva am Temaze.
– momxreebi Tu arian, msgavsi gancxadebis gareSec xom dauWeren mxars?
– albaT, axla SeeryaT poziciebi, radgan ukve gamoqveynda avtoritetuli britanuli kompaniis kvleva, sadac dadasturda, rom Zalian maRalia mmarTveli partiis reitingi, igi 56%-s utoldeba. amitom aRar eridebian aranair gancxadebas, oRond daibevon adgili qveynis sakanonmdeblo organoebSi (parlamentsa da umaRles sabWoSi). erT magaliTs moviyvan: iciT, rom koronavirusis sawinaaRmdego vaqcinis misaRebad midis intensiuri kvlevebi, saqarTvelo ki ukve Cadga mis myidvelTa rigSi. mosaxleoba xedavs, rogor iqceva xelisufleba mis dasacavad. mxolod laparakiT ki ar Semoifargleba, realur qmedebebs axorcielebs. am dros ki Cvenze ganviTarebuli da mdidari qveynebis mmarTvelebi sul sxva strategias axorcieleben, ris gamoc maTi moqalaqeebi mxolod Cvens Semdeg SeZleben am vaqcinis gamoyenebas. adamiani am parametrebiT operirebs, am faqtebiT dgeba is suraTi, rasac xalxze zrunva da pasuxismgebloba hqvia. opozicias es ar esmis an ar surs gaigos, amitomac atrialebs realobas ise, rom raRac negativi gamoadnos sakuTari Tavis sasargeblod. kidev erTxel vimeoreb, aravin aravis uSlis amomrCevelTan Sexvedras. Tanac aqtiurad iyeneben eleqtronul saSualebebsac. TqvenTanac movidoda sxvadasxva partiis Setyobineba, sadac gTxoven xmis micemas da sakuTar programas da xedvebsac gacnoben. ra Tqma unda, garkveulad SeizRudeba Sexvedrebi, magram es xdeba isev da isev mosaxleobis janmrTelobisTvis. gaikeTon pirbadeebi, daicvan distancia da Caataron Sekrebebi sadac da rodesac surT da ikontaqton, ramdenic undaT.
– saerTaSoriso damkvirveblebi rogor Camovlen – sazRvrebi xom Caketilia?
– ki, magram arCevnebamde TiTqmis ori Tvea darCenili da aravin icis, rogor ganviTardeba movlenebi. SesaZloa, Cacxres virusis talRa. Tanac 8 dRea karantini, ase rom, 10 dRiT adre Camosuli damkvirvebeli SeZlebs srulfasovan monawileobas arCevnebSi. Cveni politikuri Tavisuflebis xarisxi imdenad maRalia, aseT kiTxvebs ar unda warmoqmnides. quCaSi rom gaaCeroT nebismieri da hkiTxoT, visi satelitia arasamTavroboebi, gipasuxeben, wina mTavrobis ufro iyo vidre amJamindeliso. imdenad antagonisturad aris arasamTavroboTa didi nawili ganwyobili Cven mimarT da ise Riad uWers mxars opozicias, eWvs aRaravisSi iwvevs. opoziciis da arasamTavroboebis demokratiul garemoSi aqtiurobis fonze, mikvirs, rogor axerxeben brali dagvdon zewolasa da arasamarTlebriv qmedebebSi. amitom vambob, kiTxvis niSnebs ganzrax aCenen. Cven mier Seqmnili garemos demokratiis xarisxi da TviTregulaciis meqanizmi imdenad maRalia, im SemTxvevaSic ki, Tu naklebi saerTaSoriso damkvirvebeli Camova, amaze problemis Seqmna TiTidan gamowovili iqneba, WiqaSi qariSxlis datrialebas daemsgavseba, miT umetes, rom saarCevno kanonSi cvlilebebic Sevida, rac uzrunvelyofs arCevnebis samarTlianad Catarebas.
– gamodis, aranairi gayalbeba ar iqneba . . .
– Tu adamiani civi gonebiT gaaanalizebs arsebul viTarebas, mixvdeba, rom es braldebebi absurdulia. Tanac, aseTi politikuri speqtris fonze, romelic uzrunvelyofs xelisuflebasTan dapirispirebaSi myof uamrav damkvirvebels da komisiis wevrs TiToeul ubanze. warmoidgineT, vin unda gaayalbos, isini Tavad gaayalbeben? Tanac bevri gayalbebisgan dacvis meqanizmi daemata wina xelisuflebebis mier Seqmnil saarCevno kodeqss, rodesac marTla yalbdeboda amomrCevlebis rogorc raodenoba, ise – vinaoba. albaT, Cems sityvebs adasturebs is 56%-ic, romelic zemoT xsenebuli gamokiTxvebiT dadginda. Cveulebrivi rigiTi amomrCeveli amas yvelafers Zalian kargad xvdeba da imitomac gviWers mxars. im sicruesac xedavs, romelic maTi televiziebidan da arasamTavroboebidan yoveldRiurad moedineba.
– mainc ras xedavs amomrCeveli, xom ver dagvikonkretebdiT?
– elementarulad, baTumis quCebSi rom gaivlis adamiani da Semdeg moismens – dapauzebulia aWara, ar gauCndeba SekiTxvebi an warsuls rom gadaxedavs, ra xdeboda 2012 wlamde da ra xdeba axla? maSin iyo saseirno adgilebi, anbanis koSki Tu msgavsi sapiaro Senobebi, axla ki aSenda stadioni, respublikuri saavadmyofo, sportis sasaxleebi, ragbis moednebi, sportuli kompleqsebi, Sendeba sauniversiteto qalaqebi, avtobanebi. baTumis ubans simbolurad `Waobi~ SerCa saxelwodebad, Torem absoluturad mowesrigebulia. iq mcxovrebTa uZravi qonebis fasi gasammagda. gazi Sevida maRalmTian aWaraSi, razec verc ki ocnebobdnen iqaurebi. male gazis milebi gaerTiandeba adigenTan da moxdeba soflebis daqselianeba, erTiani sartyeli Seiqmneba. Tbilisamde gza Semcirebulia. 50-60 km-iani avtobani gakeTda 2012 wlamde da 50 prezentacia moewyo, axla ki 100-ze meti kilometriT gaizarda avtobani da arc gapiarebula zedmetad. soflis gzebi mowesrigda, sasmeli wylis milebi ideba yvelgan, miuval adgilebSic ki. 20-jer meti saqme keTdeba, Tanac ise, rom amaze arc laparakoben, Tumca, xalxi xom xedavs? gasakeTeblis meti ra aris darCenili, magram ukve gadaxnulia aqamde jagnarSi gadazrdili miwebi. es xom dovlaTs Seqmnis xval da zeg? avad rom gaxdeboda adamiani, lombardSi mirboda, nivTebs abarebda da . . . axla mkurnalobis umetes nawils sayovelTao jandacva afinansebs, piradi qoneba da miwa gadarCenilia. penitencialuri sistemis mdgomareoba yvelas gvaxsovs – axla patimarTa ricxvi 35 aTasidan 9 aTasamde davida. es ar aris ubralo ricxvebi – 20 aTasamde ojaxs xom moexsna tragedia. ra vTqva, aRar vici, opozicias ki sxva araferi darCenia, garda imisa, rom daZabos, gaarTulos, gaamuqos arsebuli realoba.
– imasac acxadeben, rom saarCevno komisiaSi `ocnebis~ mxardamWerebi SegyavT . . .
– Tu mosaxleobis 56% gviWers mxars, cxadia, 10 kacSi 6-7 adamiani Cveni mxardamWeri iqneba. ise, Tu ar daizarebT da gadaxedavT wina arCevnebis mimdinareobas, naxavT, rom analogiuri braldebebi ismis yvela jerze. axals verafers igoneben.
– administraciuli resursebis gamoyenebazec aris saubrebi.
– imitom SevitaneT cvlilebebi kanonSi da vcdilobT, yvelaferi TvalnaTeli iyos. ar viyenebT Cven am administraciul resursebs, kanons gareT ar gavdivarT. faqts ver asaxeleben, radgan msgavsi ar arsebobs, Torem mxolod saubrebiT rom ar Semoifarglebodnen da aaWrelebdnen presasac da televiziasac, kargad iciT.
– isev dgas dRis wesrigSi amomrCevlis mosyidvis Tema. axla aqtualuria koronavirusis gamo gacemul sxvadasxva Tanxaze saubari.
– rom ar davexmaroT, ityvian, ar exmarebian da xalxi am mdgomareobaSi datoveso. mokled, `Wrelo pepelas~ varianti gamodis. me erTs vityvi – mTavroba TavCaRunuli akeTebs Tavis saqmes maRal doneze, xalxisTvis zrunavs da irjeba. es procesi gagrZeldeba, rac gasakeTebelia, gakeTdeba. Cveni xelisufleba ar moiqceva ise, rogorc moiqca saakaSvili 2008 wels, rodesac xalxi gakotrda. lari aravisTvis miuciaT zaralis asanazRaureblad. pandemiis gamo adamianebma xelfasebi da sxva Semosavali dakarges da Tu saxelmwifo 300 lariT daexmara an 200 lari dauricxa bavSvebs, amiT, SesaZloa, srulad vera, magram mcirediT mainc daudga mxarSi sakuTar moqalaqeebs. ras niSnavs mosyidva, aba unda migvetovebina yuradRebis gareSe? aravis vakadrebT mivuTiToT, vis misces xma orasi laris sanacvlod. Tu gnebavT, elementaruli maTematika moviSvelioT. 56%-ia Cveni, 44% xom aris opoziciis ojaxebis? maT `mosyidvas~ xom ver SevZlebdiT am 200 lariT, arada, maT bavSvebsac daurigda. amitomaa es braldeba usafuZvlo. saxelmwifo daexmara uklebliv yvelas, vinc Sedioda Tanxebis gadasaricx miznobriv jgufSi.
– axlaxan gavrcelda informacia, rom saqarTvelos moexsna `mwvane zonis~ statusi. rogorc eqimi, ra prognozs gaakeTebT – ra gvelodeba?
– ratomRac darwmunebuli var, rom es monacemebi Zalian male daiwevs da aRvidgenT Zvel statuss, radgan pandemiis Semotevis pirvelive dRidan mTavrobam swori gadawyvetilebebiT uzrunvelyo mosaxleobis maqsimaluri usafrTxoeba. rogorc amiran gamyreliZem Tqva, mobiloba gaizarda qveyanaSi, ramac meore talRa aagora. axla isev SeizRuda procesebi, Tanac problema ar gvaqvs arc pisiar-testebis, arc pirbadeebis da arc klinikebis mxriv, medpersonalze aRarafers vambob. saxeldaxelod gakeTebul laboratoriebSi mosaxleoba masobrivad gadis testirebas. daadgenen, vin aris inficirebuli, rac SeaCerebs virusis ukontrolo gavrcelebas da viTareba isev dastabilurdeba.
– ramdenad aqvs `qarTul ocnebas~ xelisuflebaSi mesamed mosvlis Sansi?
– nebismier civilizebul saxelmwifoSi, sadac aris saparlamento mmarTveloba, partiis xelisuflebaSi mosvlis jeradoba ar izomeba. imarjvebs is, vinc miiRebs amomrCevlis met xmas. `qarTuli ocneba~ xelisuflebaSi koaliciurad iyo 4 weli. Semdeg moiZebna forma – bloki ar iyo, magram mmarTvelobaSi Semodioda kidev 3 partia (`mwvaneTa~, konservatorebi, socialistebi), anu meore jerzec ar iyo erTpartiuli mmarTveloba. am arCevnebze `qarTuli ocneba~ gamodis absoluturad damoukideblad da Tu Cven amomrCeveli mogvcems mandats, maSin gveqneba pirveli erTpartiuli oTxwliani mmarTvelobis periodi, Tu ara, albaT, Seikvreba koalicia im partiebTan, romlebTanac TanamSromlobas Cveni partiis politsabWo gadawyvets. vfiqrob, amis saWiroeba ar iqneba.

