ილია ვერძაძე: მედიატორის დოკუმენტზე ხელმოწერის გარეშე საკანონმდებლო ორგანოებში შესვლა სხვა არაფერია, თუ არა საკუთარ კომფორტზე ზრუნვა
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`erTiani nacionaluri moZraoba~ saqarTvelos parlamentSi Sedis. sakanonmdeblo organoSi saqmianobis gagrZelebis gadawyvetileba ramdenime dRis win partiis politsabWos sxdomaze miiRes. sazogadoebas amis Sesaxeb Tavad partiis Tavmjdomare nika meliam amcno. cnobilia isic, rom `erTiani nacionaluri moZraoba~ Sarl miSelis dokuments xels ar moawers
– miviReT gadawyvetileba, rom evropuli mediaciiT SemoTavazebul dokuments xeli ar movaweroT, magram udides pativiscemas vudastureb evrokavSirs, personalurad prezident miSels, danielsons, keli degnans da gansakuTrebuli madloba – karl harcels. am SeTanxmebaSi aris erTi punqti, romelic kategoriulad miuRebelia da am yvelafris gaTvaliswinebiT Cven am dokuments xels ver movawerT, Tumca, ra Tqma unda, sxva sakiTxebTan mimarTebaSi Tavidan bolomde CaverTvebiT sakanonmdeblo sakiTxebis gadawyvetaSi da vibrZolebT sxva opoziciur partiebTan erTad, rom es mavnebloba, romelsac adgili aqvs `qarTuli ocnebis~ mxridan da ukve daarRvies araerTi SeTanxmeba, SevboWoT da ar mivceT gasaqani damatebiT mavneblobas, – acxadebs nika melia.
mmarTveli partia `erTian nacionalur moZraobas~ Sarl miSelis dokumentze xelmosawerad gonivrul vadas aZlevs, winaaRmdeg SemTxvevaSi isini am dokumentiT gaTvaliswinebul samuSao procesSi ver CaerTvebian.
– es aris Cveni saerTaSoriso partniorebis absoluturad adekvaturi Sefaseba. bunebrivia, miSelis dokumentis xelmoweris gareSe `nacmoZraobis~ parlamentSi Semosvlas arc materialuri, arc formaluri fasi ar aqvs. aqedan gamomdinare, logikuria partniorebis mowodeba, rom `nacmoZraobam~ xeli moaweros am dokuments. igive pozicia gvaqvs Cvenc. ufro metic, xazgasmiT aRvniSnavT, rom vidre gonivrul vadaSi xeli ar moewereba am dokuments, manamde `nacmoZraoba~ ver CaerTveba vercerT samuSao procesSi, romelic miSelis dokumentis aRsrulebasTan aris dakavSirebuli. maT mouwevT am dokumentze xelmowera, – acxadebs `qarTuli ocnebis~ Tavmjdomare irakli kobaxiZe da iqve dasZens, rom gonivruli vadis amowurvis Sesaxeb sazogadoebas saTanado dros acnobebs.
bunebrivia, opozicias dokumentze xelmouwerlobas uwunebs mmarTveli gundi. maT Sorisaa umravlesobis deputati nikoloz samxaraZe.
– maT iseve mouwevT am dokumentze xelmowera, rogorc Tavdaxrilebsa da darcxvenilebs mouwiaT parlamentSi Semosvla. `erTiani nacionaluri moZraobis~ warmomadgenlebs sakuTar qcevebsa da politikaSi acdena aqvT. Tuki parlamentSi Sarl miSelis dokumentis xelmouwerlad Semodiodnen, maSin ratom ar Semovidnen dekemberSi da ra iyo maT mier gamocxadebuli boikotis mizezi?! sazogadoebas unda uTxran, ratom ar aweren xels Sarl miSelis dokuments an aqamde ratom ar Semodiodnen parlamentSi, – acxadebs nikoloz samxaraZe.
saqarTvelos parlamentis msgavsad, `erTiani nacionaluri moZraoba~ saqmianobas gaagrZelebs aWaris umaRles sabWoSic. opoziciis am gadawyvetilebis da qveyanaSi mimdinare politikuri procesebis Sefaseba regionis sakanonmdeblo organos umravlesobis deputats ilia verZaZes vTxoveT.
– batono ilia, principSi, mosalodneli iyo, rom `erTiani nacionaluri moZraoba~ sakanonmdeblo organoebSi Sevidoda. rogor SeafasebT am gadawyvetilebas?
– es gadawyvetileba dagvianebulic iyo da dausabuTebelic, magram mTavaria, rom moxda am politikuri Zalis lustracia. TavianTi qmedebiT aCvenes, rom maTTvis ar aris mniSvnelovani arc sakuTari mxardamWerebi, arc evropa da evropuli faseulobebi. dauSves uxeSi Secdoma da pativi ar sces amomrCevels imiT, rom am dromde ar Seudgnen muSaobas sakanonmdeblo organoSi, rac civilizebuli samyarosTvis miuRebelia. am yvelaferTan erTad, evropuli ojaxis mxridan is Zalisxmeva, rac mxolod megobars SeuZlia megobrisTvis gaakeTos, wyalSi Cayares. Tavis droze drouli reagireba ar moaxdines Sarl miSelis dokumentze, axlac ki acxadeben, rom sakanonmdeblo organoebSi Sevlen, magram dokuments xels ar moaweren. gamodis, sakuTari komfortisTvis Semodian sakanonmdeblo organoebSi. gaacnobieres, rom quCaSi rCebodnen, ar eqnebodaT xelfasi, Torem maTi mxridan produqtiulobis molodini ar maqvs, piriqiT, velodebi, rom am araswori politikuri qmedebebis raRaciT gadafarvas Seecdebian, es raRac ki iqneba destruqcia, radikalizmi, mudmivad areulobis mcdeloba da amomrCevlis SecdomaSi Seyvana. swored es iqneba maTi dRis wesrigi, sxvanairad eqvsTvian boikots verafriT gadafaraven.
– da mainc. . . ratom axla, eqvsi Tvis Semdeg? ukrainidan gasca araformalurma mmarTvelma davaleba Tu karsmomdgarma adgilobrivi TviTmmarTvelobis arCevnebma ganapiroba es?
– maTi bolo gadawyvetileba gadarCenis surviliT iyo ganpirobebuli. faqtobrivad, maTi marginalizaciis procesi midis da amas xels uwyobs qmedebebis is kaskadi, rac Caidines bolo TveebSi. axla ukve am yvelafers ver gamoasworeben, magram gadafarva SeuZliaT radikalizmiT, SeuracxyofebiT, tyuilebiT, riTac mxardamWerebis nawilis SenarCunebas Seecdebian adgilobrivi TviTmmarTvelobis arCevnebamde imitom, rom maT partiaSi rRvevis procesi dawyebulia, maTi lustracia moxda – isini prodasavluri Zala ar arian. prodasavluroba aris faseulobebi, pirvel rigSi, da roca arcerT komponentSi am faseulobas ar akmayofileb da mxolod ityuebi, kargi namdvilad ar aris. xSirad momiSveliebia abraam linkolnis sityvebi, rom SeiZleba xalxi moatyuo mcire xniT, SeiZleba xalxis nawili moatyuo didi xniT, magram yvelas didi xniT ver moatyueb. es daemarTa `erTian nacionalur moZraobas~. maT Tavidanve tyuilebi ilaparakes, magram ver moaxerxes sicruis mxardaWera. roca gamoaSkaravda maTi sicrue da cudi qmedebebi, isic ki ikadres, rom civilizebuli samyaros Txovna, fasilitaciiT miRweuli kompromisi ugulebelyves raRac gaugonari principebis gamo. es yvelaferi gvaZlevs imis Tqmis saSualebas, rom maTi mxridan es iyo ususuri politikuri svla.
– gaunawyendebian Tu ara `erTian nacionalur moZraobas~ is adamianebi, romlebic Tveebis ganmavlobaSi maTTan erTad idgnen quCaSi?
– quCaSi maTTan erTad mdgom adamianebze rom araferi vTqva, maTi gundis wevrebisgan gvesmoda, rom ar Sevidodnen parlamentSi riggareSe arCevnebis gareSe, Tumca dRes ukve Sesvlis gadawyvetileba miRebuli aqvT, anu saTaveSi, liderebSic ki problemebi aqvT. darwmunebuli var, radikaluri nawilis garda, msgavs politikur Zalas mxars aravin dauWers. `erTiani nacionaluri moZraobis~ mxridan, kidev erTxel vityvi, am formiT, anu mediatoris dokumentze xelmoweris gareSe, sakanonmdeblo organoebSi Sesvla sxva araferia, Tu ara sakuTar komfortze zrunva. partia konkretul adamianebs ver akavebda, romlebsac sakanonmdeblo organoebSi Sesvlis survili hqondaT.
– adamiani, romelic `erTian nacionalur moZraobas~ eubneboda, rom maT daasrulebda, dRes im gundis metoqea, romelsac warmoadgenda, am dReebSi ki partia daafuZna. ras ityviT giorgi gaxariaze?
– saqarTveloSi arasdros iyo waxalisebuli da arc dRes velodebi moRalateobis waxalisebas. mesmis, rom azrTa sxvadasxvaoba SeiZleba yofiliyo, magram im formiT gundidan gasvla, ra formiTac giorgi gaxaria gavida, aris Ralatis klasikuri magaliTi. giorgi gaxaria ar gansxvavdeba aqamde `qarTuli ocnebidan~ gasuli adamianebis mier Seqmnili saerTo suraTisgan.
– ufro konkretulad, ras fiqrobT giorgi gaxarias gundze da ra Sansebi aqvs partias `saqarTvelosTvis~ adgilobrivi TviTmmarTvelobis arCevnebSi?
– aranairi Sansi ar unda hqondes, Ralati waxalisebuli ar iqneba sazogadoebis mxridan. wasvla sxva formiT SeiZleboda da ara moRalateobrivad.
– batono ilia, Tqveni gundis yofili wevri da qveynis yofili premieri dRes aqcentebs akeTebs nepotizmze, korufciaze. . . arada, ramdenime Tvis win mis xelSi iyo qveynis marTvis sadaveebi. . .
– sruli anaqronizmia, Tavsebadi araa civilur politikur procesTan is, rasac giorgi gaxaria akeTebs. im dRis wesrigiT Seqmnil politikur partias, rac kiTxvaSi CamoayalibeT da gunds seriozuli mxardaWera ver eqneba, dabali iqneba maTi reitingic da adgilobriv TviTmmarTvelobis arCevnebSi miRebuli xmebis raodenobac. im adamianebis mikvirs, romlebic cdiloben giorgi gaxarias daukavSiron TavianTi politikuri momavali, radgan Ralatze dafuZnebuli politikuri partia ara mgonia, rom seriozul Sedegs miaRwevs.
– `qarTulma ocnebam~ daiwyo samzadisi arCevnebisTvis, axlaxan regionSi partiis liderebi imyofebodnen. . .
– `qarTul ocnebas~ kargi begraundi aqvs, es aris etapi saqarTvelos uaxles istoriaSi, roca erTma konkretulma politikurma Zalam moaxerxa da Tavisi lideris da damfuZneblis ZalisxmeviT, mocemuloba, mimarTuleba Seucvala qveyanas. miuxedavad imisa, rom dabrkoleba, destruqcia, usafuZvlo kritika iyo Zlian bevri, Cven mainc vaxerxebT swori gziT svlas. rac ar unda ilaparakon, faqtebs versad gaveqceviT – asocirebis xelSekruleba xelmowerilia, vizaliberalizacia amoqmedebuli, gvyavs udidesi megobarTa jgufi, romelTa daxmareba da mxardaWera wlidan wlamde izrdeba. udidesi gamowveva iyo pandemia da yvela nabiji adasturebs imas, rom adekvaturi da optimaluri iyo xelisuflebis qmedebebi. turistul bazarze saqarTvelosadmi ndoba didia da yoveldRiurad izrdeba turistebis nakadi. aRniSvnis Rirsia ganaTleba, sayovelTao jandacva, C hepatitis eliminaciis da sxva programebi. iseTi begraundi aqvs `qarTul ocnebas~, konkurencias ver gagviweven.
– Tqveni gundi gamarjvebisTvis mzadaa?
– diax, amjeradac mzad varT gamarjvebisTvis.