,,…მიშელის დოკუმენტში აჭარის უმაღლესი საბჭოს ჩაწერა არავის გახსენებია”
õïüòï òïøâòäò 27 48 93 –
opozicia Sevida aqamde mSvidad myof aWaris umaRles sabWoSi da daiwyo `cxeli~ dReebi, ufro sworad, sxdomebi. imis miuxedavad, rom pirvelive sxdomis Semdeg orive mxarem dado piroba `mets ar vizamTo~, meoreze kidev ufro uaresi dRe ayares erTmaneTs. amomrCeveli aSkarad SeSinebuli uyurebs sakuTari arCevanis Sedegs da ukve eZebs mesame Zalas, romelic Caanacvlebs qarTuli politikuri speqtris orive liders.
Tu ra moxda sxdomaze, ras apireben samomavlod da saerTod, ratom gadawyvites sakanonmdeblo organoSi Sesvla, amaze saubrobs `aWarasTan~ interviuSi umaRlesi sabWos wevri medea vasaZe.
– qalbatono medea, Rirda Tu ara 6-Tviani boikoti, Tuki mainc SexvidodiT umaRles sabWoSi. ra moigeT?
– swored am 6- Tvianma boikotma SegvaZlebina sakanonmdeblo organoebSi Cveni pirobebis gaTvaliswinebiT Sesvla. evrokavSiris meTvalyureobiT Sedga garigeba pozicia-opozicias Soris, romlis nawilsac ar veTanxmebiT, magram mainc vTvliT, rom win gadadgmuli nabijia imdenad, ramdenadac, 43%-iani barieris gadaulaxaobis SemTxvevaSi, unda Catardes vadamdeli arCevnebi. am SeTanxmebas referendumis donis mniSvneloba aqvs. aqamde ki swored opoziciis erTianobam da principulobam migviyvana.
– miSelis dokuments xeli ar moawereT da ratom fiqrobT, rom SeTanxmeba ar dakargavs Zalas?
– gaerTianebuli opoziciis ramdenime subieqtma moawera xeli, mxolod `nacionalurma moZraobam~ Seikava Tavi, radgan miaCnia, rom moZalade da politikuri patimari erT sibrtyeSi ar unda ganixilebodes da orives ar unda Seexos amnistia. kanoni erTnairad ar SeiZleba vrceldebodes dazaralebulsa da damzaralebelze.
– amas rogorc `nacionaluri partiis~ warmomadgeneli ise ambobT?
– me ar var am partiis wevri, SeiZleba moviazrebode, magram namdvilad ar var. opoziciur blokSi warmovadgen partias `emsaxure saqarTvelos~, magram radgan am gaerTianebaSi wamyvani Zalaa `nacionaluri moZraoba~, iZulebuli var, viyo maTi gadawyvetilebis qudis qveS.
– yovelTvis eTanxmebiT `nacionalebis~ gadawyvetilebebs?
– zogjer – ki, zogjer – ara, magram amas arsebiTi mniSvneloba naklebad aqvs. ZiriTadad viRebdi maT gadawyvetilebas, radgan mimdinare politikur procesebSi saboloo miznis misaRwevad es erTianoba aucilebeli iyo. aqedan gamomdinare, vTqviT, rom am etapze ar vawerT xels miSelis dokuments. SesaZloa, samomavlod ise warimarTos procesebi, rom `nacionalurma moZraobamac~ moaweros xeli. parlamentis Tavmjdomarem TiTqos dagvsaja, gamoacxada, rom amis gamo ver vimuSavebT sasamarTlo reformasTan Tu kanonmdeblobaSi sxva cvlilebebTan dakavSirebul jgufebSi.
– gamodis, SexvediT sakanonmdeblo organoebSi, magram dautvirTavi darCiT?
– ara, rac reglamentiTaa gaTvaliswinebuli, imaze uari ar gviTqvams, radgan kanonis Sesrulebas win veraferi aRudgeba da mogexsenebaT, amis SesrulebisTvisac, maincdamainc, ar varT mowadinebuli.
– ra posti daikaveT aWaris umaRles sabWoSi?
– aWaraSi komitetebis Tavmjdomareebis moadgileebis Tanamdebobebze gavediT, radgan umaRlesi sabWos reglamentiT iyo gaTvaliswinebuli. me SemomTavazes iuridiuli komiteti da davTanxmdi Tavmjdomaris moadgilis posts. sxvaTa Soris, es reglamenti wina mowvevis umaRlesma sabWom miiRo. maSin gadawyda, rom modgile aucileblad unda yofiliyo opoziciis warmomadgeneli. amas pozitiurad SevxvdiT, radgan gacilebiT demokratiulia sakiTxis mimarT aseTi midgoma.
– qalbatono medea, axla ukve meored gaxdiT umaRlesi sabWos wevri. pirvelad `qarTulma ocnebam~ wargadginaT. ra moxda, ratom datoveT sakmaod mniSvnelovani Tanamdebobebi da ratom CaudeqiT sakuTar partias opoziciaSi?
– xelisuflebaSi mosvlidan, daaxloebiT, erT weliwadSi mivxvdi, rom acdenili viyaviT im dapirebebs, romelic uxvad gaveciT winasaarCevnod.
– ratom hpirdebodiT, Tuki SesrulebaSi ar iyaviT darwmunebuli?
– imitom, rom Cveni lideri ase gvpirdeboda da Cvenc vimeorebdiT, bunebrivia. Tanac, Zalian provincialuri damokidebuleba hqonda centrs regionisadmi. yvela `nacionali~, romelic arafers warmoadgenda sakuTar partiaSi da SemCneuli iyo aTasgvar kriminalSi, erTbaSad gadavida `qarTul ocnebaSi~, romelmac Zalian aqtiurad Seisruta da uxmod moaxdina maTi integrireba mmarTvel gundSi. ideuri `nacionalebi~ ki darCnen `erTian nacionalur moZraobaSi~.
– gamodis, isev `nacionalebs~ gamoeqeciT?
– aba, ratom unda davrCeniliyavi kriminalebTan, ar jobda ideur xalxTan gaerTianeba? maSin davtove `qarTuli ocneba~, radgan samarTlianobis aRdgena ver moaxerxa da bevr rameSi CaiWra. . . rom mivdiodi, isic miTxres, RalatSi CageTvlebao. maSin vpasuxobdi da axlac gavimeoreb: me ki ar vuRalate `ocnebas~, man miRalata me.
– Tqven maSin wamoxvediT, rodesac jer kidev myarad idga partia fexze, axla ki TandaTan kargavs liderebsac da aqtivistebsac. . .
– diax, `qarTuli ocneba~ Signidan iSleba, radgan misi wevrebi xvdebian im usamarTlobas, rac xdeba qveyanaSi.
– igives ambobdiT, rodesac `nacionalebs~ ebrZodiT. ra Seicvala?
– `erTiani nacionaluri moZraobis~ xelisuflebaSi mosvlis Semdeg rom daemsgavsa saqarTvelo saxelmwifos, amas veravin uaryofs. 9 wlis ganmavlobaSi viyavi winaaRmdegobaSi maTTan, magram mainc vambobdi, rom saxelmwifo instituciebi maSin Camoyalibda. gaixseneT, ras gavda Cveni policia, avtoinspeqcia, sagadasaxado. marto sajaro reestris Seqmna rad Rirda. axla, Rilakis erTi daWeriT Rebulob yvela saWiro informacias, aRar giwevs mTel qalaqSi sirbili da rigebSi dgoma. marTalia, ver veguebodi imas, rac xdeboda, xSirad TviTnebobas da Tavxedobasac rom niSnavda, magram aqeT rom davdeqi, vnaxe, aRarc qveyana Sendeboda, `dapauzda~ yvelaferi da adamianis uflebebsac aRar Tvlian arafrad. is ki arada, kriminalis gamoZiebasac ver axerxeben normalurad. Tu maSin vambobdiT, rom cixeebi iyo gadatvirTuli, axla vambobT, rom sazogadoebaa kriminalebiT datvirTuli… maxsovs, manqanas ar vketavdi, axla kidevac vrazav da mofarebul adgilebsac varCev parkirebisTvis.
– e.i. isev cixeebi unda gadaitvirTos?
– aseT radikalizmSi nu gadaviWrebiT, Tumca ukve im azramde mivedi, rom is `xeli~ saWiro iyo. `nacionalebis~ lideri, qveynis mesame prezidenti axlac ambobs: reformebi iyo aRsaqmelad Zalian mZime, iyo mtkivneuli, magram aucilebeli. Cemi gadasaxedidan davrwmundi, rom is dro ufro simSvides maZlevda.
– eTanxmebiT saakaSvilis Camosvlas da kvlav gaprezidentebas?
– mixeili Zalian emociuri adamiania da misi prezidentoba albaT, ar iqneba misaRebi, imis miuxedavad, rom aRiarebs Secdomebs. Tumca, iqve akeTebs aqcents warmatebebze, reformebis saxiT rom ganxorcielda Cvens qveyanaSi. me mimaCnia, rom saqarTvelos koaliciuri mTavroba unda hyavdes. erTpirovnuli mmarTveloba ar adgeba saqarTvelos, amasTan, humanuroba unda iqces normad. imedi maqvs, erTad dgomiT da principulobiT mivaRwevT amas.
– umaRlesi sabWos meore sxdoma, dapirebis miuxedavad, pirvelze ufro xmauriani iyo. . .
– diax, aSkarad xmauriani gamogvivida esec, magram Jurnalistebs giyvarT Cveni Sexla-Semoxla, ase rom, guli nu dagwydebaT (icinis). xumroba iqiT iyos da marTlac ar vapirebdiT Cxubs, vTqviT, rom sazogadoeba isedac gadaRlilia da nu gavamZafrebT umaRles sabWoSi Camoyalibebul agresiul fons. . . magram ar gamogvivida arc wina sxdomaze da arc axla, imitom rom Zalian cudad Segvxvdnen.
– Tu Tqveni Sesvla ar surdaT, ratom ar Segiwyvites uflebamosileba, rodesac mosTxoveT?
– Zalian ar undodaT Cveni Sesvla, magram ra eqnaT, xel-fexi hqondaT Sekruli. eseni gadawyvetilebas damoukideblad ver iReben. aRsaniSnavia, rom maT Soris bevria yofili `nacionali~, romelic axla aqeT mebrZvis. sxvaTa Soris, Cems statusSi davwere da minda aqac gavimeoro: `sajarod vacxadeb, rom Cems yvela statusTan dakavSirebiT vwyvet yovelgvar komentars im adamianebTan, romlebmac ar ician da verc verasodes mixvdebian, Tu ras niSnavs xelisuflebaSi yofnis dros, Sens xelT arsebuli seriozuli gavlenebis pirobebSi, formalurad ki ara, roca namdvilad monawileob sakiTxebis gadawyvetaSi, sul cota, eqvsi wliT gaqvs saamuri da uzrunveli momavali – datovo xelisufleba da waxvide opoziciaSi. . . hoda, nuRar gairjebiT Tqveni boRmiani mosazrebebis Cems gverdze gadmonTxeviT, girCevT, Tqvens partiasTan da Sesabamisad, damsaqmeblebTan Tqveni amoraluri valdebulebebis angariSsworebisaTvis sxva gzis arCevas. . .~
– mmarTvel gundSi Tvlian, rom gaxarias partia xmebs gaerTianebul opozicias waarTmevs.
– oRond, ara `erTian nacionalur moZraobas~, romelsac hyavs myari amomrCeveli. swored `ocnebas~ waarTmevs xmebsac da adamianur resurssac, amitom uyureben ase mZimed yofili premieris politikaSi axali statusiT dabrunebas. am gadasaxedidan kargad Cans, rom gaxarias ara mxolod Sansi aqvs, SeZlebs `qarTuli ocnebis~ srulad gapartaxebas.
– Tqven ar amtkicebT, rom gaxaria ivaniSvilis miTiTebiT moqmedebs?
– erTi periodi ase vfiqrobdi, magram am bolos meeWveba. iseT `daukrefavebSi~ gadavidnen gaxarias mimarT, rom aRar mgonia. vnaxoT, jer kidev gvaqvs dro, romelic sabolood daalagebs yvelafers.
– TviTmmarTvelobis arCevnebis gayalbebas elodebiT?
– axla `qarTuli ocnebis~ yofna-ar yofnis sakiTxi wydeba da cxadia, Zalian Seecdebian. mcdeloba iqneba, magram ar miecemaT amis saSualeba. RmerTma nu qnas, rom ganvlil politikur kriziss isini gonze ar moeyvana.
– aWaras ramdenad Seexeba vadamdeli arCevnebi?
– es marTlac problemaa, radgan miSelis dokumentSi aWaris umaRlesi sabWos Cawera aravis gaxsenebia. albaT, gadawydeba, aWara rogor miebas am SeTanxmebas, radgan samarTlebrivad am aqts problemebi aqvs. sxvaTa Soris, es kiTxva davusvi umaRlesi sabWos Tavmjdomares da Zalian saRi pasuxi gamca: aWara ver gava erovnuli procesebidan (arCevnebidan), radgan ar mouxdeba Cvens regions aq iyos sxva xelisuflebao. ase rom, problemas vxedav, magram imeds vitoveb, rom dadebiTad gadawydeba.
– Tqveni prognoziT, vadamdeli arCevnebis Catarebis SemTxvevaSi, vin mova saqarTvelos saTaveSi?
– me piradad, koaliciuri mTavrobisTvis vibrZoleb. opozicia unda iyos warmodgenili rogorc sakanonmdeblo, ise aRmasrulebel xelisuflebaSi. gadanawildeba mimarTulebebi da gaxelisuflebuli opozicia iqneba pasuxismgebeli qveynis marTvaze. . . minda yvela politikurma Zalam Tavi moiyaros saqarTvelos parlamentSi, raTa quCidan wamomZaxebeli aRar darCes. minda demokratiuli da samarTliani qveyana, gaRimebuli da dapurebuli qarTveli minda, yvelaferi kargi minda. . . vin unda moitanos es yvelaferi, Tu ara – Cven?
