ექიმები – ტროლების წინააღმდეგ!
მარიამ ხითარიშვილი 27 48 93 –
`maT pozicias hqvia: `saavadmyofoSi
ar mixvide, mogklaven!~
kardiologi ioseb sixaruliZe Tvlis, rom xalxSi gavrcelebulia undobloba samedicino sferos mimarT, rac Rrmavdeba pandemiis msxverplTa raodenobis zrdis gamo.
ras miiCnevs eqimi gamosavlad, amaze saubrobs interviuSi.
– batono ioseb, Tuki Tqven mier feisbukze gamoqveynebuli postebiT vimsjelebT, Zalian SeSfoTebuli CanxarT. ras aprotestebT?
– ki ar vaprotesteb an vakritikeb, pozicias vadastureb. sakiTxi exeba mecniereba – medicinas im urTules periodSi, rodesac msoflioSi pandemia mZvinvarebs. yvelaze metad mTrgunavs mosaxleobis nawilSi gavrcelebuli azri, TiTqos samedicino personali CarTulia erTgvar SeTqmulebaSi kacobriobis winaaRmdeg, anu, Turme, momarTuli vyofilvarT, rac SeiZleba meti adamiani gavwyvitoT. situacia TiTqos arc ise dramatulad viTardeboda, magram am bolos klinikebis mimarT gamZafrebulma SiSma mimiyvana im azramde, rom es aris sufTa wylis diversia saxelmwifos winaaRmdeg.
– ratom – diversia?
– eqimebis didi nawili dabulingebul-Seuracxyofil-marginalizirebulia garkveuli jgufebis mier, romlebic, erTi mxriv, vaqcinaciis winaaRmdegni arian (gamodis, xels aZlevT daavadebis gavrceleba), meore mxriv, aSineben inficirebulebs, `iq~ ar mixvideT, mogklaveno. Tanac ugulebelyofen jandacvis msoflio organizaciis mier SemuSavebul yvela rekomendacias, romelic Seexeba distancirebas, pirbadis tarebas Tu pirad higienas. TavianT samwysos afrTxileben, es aris Cveulebrivi gripi, gadaivlis, nu daujerebT eqimebs, nu aicrebiTo da a. S.
– visze gaqvT eWvi, vin udgas saTaveSi mTel am kampanias?
– me ra eWvi unda mqondes? es saxelmwifos saqmea, uSiSroebis, unda gamoiZion, vin ayalibebs aseT jgufebs da ra aqvT miznad.
– Tqven migaCniaT, rom mTel am absurds konkretuli adamianebi specialurad atrialeben?
– ra Tqma unda, darwmunebuli var amaSi. imdenad siRrmiseul trolur sivrceebs qmnian, rom es yvelaferi ar da ver moxdeba SemTxveviT gavrcelebuli Worebis meqanizmiT. zogs uflis xati udevs, zogs – RvTismSoblis da iseT ambebs yvebian da iseT videoebs avrceleben, romlebic pirdapir urtyams adamianis gonebas da myarad ikidebs fexs mis qvecnobierSi.
– ese igi, erTi da igive azrs avrceleben gansakuTrebuli fsiqologiuri meTodikis daxmarebiT?
– diax, modiT, davakvirdeT, rogori TanmimdevrobiT mimdinareobs trolebis muSaoba – maTi tiradebi iwyeba mcire simarTliT, rasac emateba mozrdili tyuili da rodesac gaiJRerebs fsevdoavtoritetebis mier, ukve iZens gavlenis uzarmazar Zalas.
– Tuki avtoritetebi aJRereben. . .
– Tuki CaeZiebiT am e. w. avtoritetebs, naxavT, rom maT 90%-s aranairi kavSiri ar aqvs arc medicinasTan, arc mis klinikur nawilTan. warmoidgineT, rogor ateroreben eqimebs am `avtoritetebis~ mier datreningebuli pacientebi. erTi mxriv, eqimebi yvelafers akeTeben kovid-daavadebulTa gadasarCenad, meore mxriv ki iZulebulni arian, Tavidan aicilon aTasgvari Seuracxmyofeli frazebi da usafuZvlo braldebebi.
– braldebebi iqneb ar aris safuZvels moklebuli, xom xdeba samedicino Secdomebi?
– ki, rogor ara, xdeba. Sors var aseTi eqimebis dacvisa da gamarTlebisgan, magram usafuZvlo imitom vaxsene, rom am braldebebis aranairi mtkicebuleba ar arsebobs. samedicino gulgriloba Tu arsebobs, unda gairkves da daisajos, vinc aris damnaSave, magram arafris gamo eqimebis gansja da maTi mkvlelebad Seracxvac xom dauSvebelia?! rodesac xarSaven erT qvabSi, aTavseben yvelas erTi qolgis qveS da mkvlelTa korpusad ixsenieben, amis daSveba danaSaulis tolfasia. me am propagandas vewinaaRmdegebi.
– Tqven amtkicebT, rom aseTi propaganda mizanmimarTulad mimdinareobs?
– ki, es propaganda rom mimdinareobs, arsebobs da aqtiurad moqmedebs, amas wyali ar gauva. ideba gamosaxulebebi, sadac aRbeWdilia satanaze miyiduli eqimebi, fauCis madidebeli samedicino personali da sxv. Tqven warmoidgineT, ra mdgomareobaSia mTlianobaSi qveyana.
– Tqven antivaqserul moZraobaze saubrobT?
– antivaqseruli pozicia, sxvaTa Soris, mecnierebaze dafuZnebuli mtkicebulebaa. mecnierTa jgufs, daSvebulia, hqondes sakuTari damokidebuleba sxvadasxva vaqcinis mimarT. aq sul sxva problema dgas – me maT antivaqserebsac ver davarqmev, maT pozicias hqvia: `saavadmyofoSi ar mixvide, mogklaven!~. . .
– mainc, ras uzamen saavadmyofoSi pacientso?
– Turme ZaliT dagawvenen reanimaciaSi, migaerTeben filtvebis ventilaciisTvis gankuTvnil aparats, Semdeg ki ramdenime dRe gagaCereben da mogklaven. aseT hipoTezebs avrceleben, romlis zegavlenis qveS eqceva jansaRad moazrovne xalxic ki.
– principSi, aparatze mierTebulTa didi nawili marTlac iRupeba.
– imitom, rom iqamde aRweven aucreli, ukve grZnobadakarguli, uaRresad garTulebul mdgomareobaSi myofi pacientebi, romlebic swored zemoxsenebuli propagandis gamo Tavs ikavebdnen saavadmyofoSi mkurnalobaze. amas adasturebs yvela – rodesac ekiTxebi, droze sad iyavi, ratom ar moiTxove hospitalizacia, gpasuxoben, imitom, rom gveSinoda, mogvklavdnen.
– Tqven mier dadebul postebSi eklesiasac akisrebT pasuxismgeblobas am sakiTxSi.
– ara, me vaxseneb eklesias da vambob, rom es xalxi eklesias, RvTis, RvTismSoblis saxels amofarebuli adamianebi arian. im xalxs, vinc 24 saaTis ganmavlobaSi iRvwis uflis mier boZebuli yvelaze didi saswaulis – sicocxlis gadasarCenad, eubnebian, mkvleli xaro. iseni arc sulierebas, arc udanaSaulobis prezumpcias arad dagideven. me Sors var im azrisgan, rom amaSi qarTuli eklesiis xeli urevia – msgavss verc da arc davuSveb. eklesiac da samedicino personalic adamianis janmrTelobas, mis sicocxles emsaxureba. erTi sulierad gadarCenas isaxavs miznad, meore – fizikurs. SesaZlebelia, wylisa da cecxlis fizikuri Tvisebebi erTmaneTs SevadaroT an erTmaneTSi avurioT? amitom SeuZlebelia erTmaneTTan polemikaSi Sesvla.
– Tqven adanaSulebT jandacvis ministrs, rodesac ambobs, rom pandemiam iklo da SesaZleblad miaCnia `qarTuli ocnebis~ momxreebis TavSeyra maSin, rodesac imave dRes cercvaZe saubrobs koronavirusis gaZlierebul talRebze.
– me pricipulad yvelanairi Sekrebis mowinaaRmdege var, radgan swored am dros xdeba yvelaze meti adamianis daviruseba. Tavad gansajeT: Tu SeiZleba brZolis velze gavideT da vaprotestoT omi, mowinaaRmdege an brZolis meTodebi? igivea aqac. arsebobs pandemiuri mdgomareoba, gvaqvs msoflio jandacvis organizaciis rekomendaciebi, romlis erT-erTi mTavari pirobaa socialuri distancireba, pirbade da vaqcinacia. ukve miliards gadaaWarba msoflioSi acril adamianTa raodenobam. iseT qveynebSi Catarda vaqcinacia warmatebulad, sadac ndoba arsebobs samedicino sferos mimarT. iq pandemiasTan brZolaSic kargi Sedegebi aqvT. aqve minda xazi gavusva – Cven raodenobaSi gvyavs meti gardacvlili da ara procentobaSi. dainficirebuli bevria, procentulad ki igive Sedegebi gvaqvs, rac aqvT warmatebul qveynebs.
– diax, yovelTvis gvawuxebs kiTxva, ratom aris amxela sikvdilianoba?
– maSin me davsvam kontrSekiTxvas – ratom aris amdeni virusiT daavadebuli? imitom, rom am xalxs miaCnia: midis eqimi pacientTan saxlSi, ZaliT mohyavs saavadmyofoSi, Semdeg ZaliT miamagrebs aparatze da asmevs wamlebs, ukeTebs inieqciebs, sabolood ki klavs. . . Tqven warmogidgeniaT, ra xdeba?! ramxela braldebas gviyeneben dRisiT, mzisiT?! Tu Cemi ar gjeraT, midiT, moikiTxeT sadgurebSi, bazarSi, quCaSi. . . gamokiTxulTa 70% amas gipasuxebT, rasac me vambob. ra gamodis, amxela danaSauli, mkvlelobebi xdeba, kriminalebiT yofila klinikebi savse, magram amaTgan arcerTi, jerjerobiT, mxilebuli da msjavrdebuli ar aris. Tqven gesmiT, saiT mivyavarT am msjelobas?!
– iqneb isic gviTxraT, ra unda gakeTdes imunizaciis Seuferxeblad Casatareblad?
– me imunologi ar var, magram maqvs sakuTari damokidebuleba am procesis mimarT. amdenma braldebam da Seuracxyofam Zalian dagvZaba meca da Cemi kolegebic. vinmem xom unda amoiRos xma da daafiqsiros sakuTari pozicia?! imunizaciis srulad Casatareblad, upirvelesad, aucilebelia, gaaCumon xalxze, qveynis sulierebasa da fizikur janmrTelobaze `mzrunveli~ trolebi, romlebic sruli ganadgurebisken miaqaneben qveyanas da ers. eseni unda gamoiTvalon da gaaneitralon. Semdeg ufro meti damajereblobiT unda vimuSaoT mosaxleobasTan. mxolod amis Semdeg dawynardeba qveyana da aRdgeba normaluri saxelmwifoebrivi viTareba.
– msjelobisas bevri samedicino daskvnebs iSveliebs. . .
– miTxariT, SesaZlebelia, me – eqimma kvanturi fizikis saxelmZRvaneloTi raime gavigo?! wakiTxviT ki wavikiTxav, magram verafers gavigeb. eqimebis laparaksac ver igebs sxva profesiis moqalaqe, araTu daweril daskvnas, miT umetes, rogori kaligrafia gvaqvs, yvelam icis. Zalian mainteresebs, rogor kiTxuloben, ras igeben da ra daskvnebs akeTeben, samedicino terminologiebis meSveobiT rom adastureben sakuTar absurdul braldebebs Cemi da Cemi kolegebis mimarT?! mere am daskvnas aqceven aqsiomad da atrialeben socialur qselebSi. ise getyvian, jer antisxeulebi unda gavisinjoT da mere avicrebiTo, TiTqos xvdebodnen, ra aris es antisxeulebi da ratom ar SeiZleba acris dros misi moWarbebuli raodenoba. Tavad xdebian eqimebic da mecnierebic. amas akeTeben isini, romlebsac arc erTi adamiani, arc erTi sicocxle ar gadaurCeniaT.
– TqvenTan saubrisas gamaxsenda stalinis droindeli `mkvleli eqimebis saqme~, romlis analogi ganmeorda saakaSvilis periodSi, rodesac bevr eqims augores braldeba da mediis saSualebiT daaSines. maSin es procesi erT larad gayiduli klinikebiT aixsna, raTa eqimTa korpuss ar gaeprotestebina gaCuqebis es meTodi.
– diax, iyo `mkvlel eqimTa saqme~, magram am SemTxvevaSi mogviwevs xalxis dadanaSauleba, rac gamoricxulia. pacienti arafer SuaSia. Tu eqimma sneuli ver daarwmuna mkurnalobis, operaciis, romelime proceduris Catarebis aucileblobaSi, es misi problemaa da ara pacientis. cxadia, sabolood isev da isev avadmyofi ziandeba, magram brali mkurnals edeba.
– Tqven kardiologi xarT. am mimarTulebiT rogor dgas sakiTxi?
– pirdapir sikvdil-sicocxlesTan maqvs Sexeba, CemTan Semodian pacientebi infarqtiT, insultiT, gulis ukmarisobiT da a. S. procentulobiT Tu vimsjelebT, ori procenti kvdeba, anu 100-dan – 2 adamiani. me rom damarqvan mkvleli im ori adamianis gardacvalebis gamo da arad Caagdon 98 kacis gadarCena, samarTliania?! iqneb amiTac daiwyon apelireba, rom es samkurnalo saSualebebi klavs adamianebs. maSin veRarc guliT daavadebulebs vumkurnalebT da gadavarCenT. aq isic minda vTqva, eqimma ver gadaarCina – sxva Temaa, magram eqimma mokla – ukve kriminalia! swored am mimarTulebiT mimdinareobs trolebis muSaoba. infeqcionistebs mkvlelebad moixsenieben mxolod imitom, rom dagvianebiT an Tanmdevi daavadebebiT misuli pacienti gardaicvala. aris raRac hipoTeturi cifrebi, romelTa ukan araferi Cans da msoflio masStabiT aseul SemTxvevas magaliTad mogiyvanen, rogorc kacobriobis amosawyvetad mimarTul SeTqmulebas, romelSic, cxadia, Cven – eqimebs gvaqvs lomis wili. samxedroebis Sinaganawesi gavixsenoT: frontis wina xazze myof meomarTa demoralizacia, SeSineba, panikis daTesva emsaxureba mtris gamarjvebas. Tu Cven eqimebSi SevitanT demoralizacias, demotivacias, gavuqrobT muSaobis yovelgvar survils da enTuziazms, rogor movereviT pandemias? romelime quCaSi rom gava da dauZaxeben, `Se mkvlelo~, amis Semdeg vinmes moundeba saoperacioSi Tu reanimaciul ganyofilebaSi Sesvla?
– mTlad ase rTulad ar dgas sakiTxi. . .
– dgas, rogor ara, gaxSirda aseTi SemTxvevebi. vinmes Tu hgonia, rom reanimaciuli sivrce silamazis salonia, Zalian Semcdara. es aris yvelaze mZime, yofiTi adgili, iq Tu ar arsebobs pacientebisa da momsaxure personalis urTierTTanamSromloba da urTierTgageba, mTeli mkurnaloba wyalSi gadaiyreba. Tumca, rogor unda iTanamSromlon, rodesac isev da isev ismis frazebi: pirbade maxrCobs, korona Cveulebrivi gripia, Cems cols hqonda kovidi, magram me ar gadamedo da sxv. es sityvebi xom gecnobaT?! erTi da igive postulatebis ganmeoreba ukve asprocentiani propagandaa. xalxsa da samedicino sferos Soris gaCenil am uzarmazar ufskruls garda, minda xazgasmiT aRvniSno, rom saqarTveloSi eqimebis gadamzadeba, maTi kvalifikaciis amaRleba an Tundac, SenarCuneba ar xdeba da es maSin, rodesac amzadeben policias, samxedroebs, mexanZreebs, pedagogebs da a.S. eqimebze aravin fiqrobs. Tanac, gvTxoven, maRali standartebiT gaTvaliswinebuli, evropuli samedicino servisi mivawodoT pacientebs. Tumca, CvenTan mosulTa arcTu mcire nawili sapirispiro damokidebulebas iCens Cven mimarT. minda visargeblo SemTxveviT da mivmarTo Tqvens mkiTxvels: Cemo xalxo, nu davcalkevdebiT, nu davSordebiT erTmaneTs, davdgeT erTad, daviwyoT dialogi, nebismier kiTxvaze gulwrfelad gipasuxebT. merwmuneT, arcerT eqims, arcerT medmuSaks ar uxaria es yofa. Tu mkvlelia eqimi, Tu daaSava da dauziana pacients janmrTeloba, me pirveli moviTxov mis gasamarTlebas da dasjas. oRond gamovavlinoT danaSauli, SeviswavloT sakiTxi da davicvaT udanaSaulobis prezumpcia.
