,,პოლიტიკურ გარემოსა და საზოგადოებას შორის ფორმირდება ერთგვარი ,,კულტურული ომი”, ანუ იდეურ ინტერესთა კონფლიქტი”
ხატია იაშვილი 591 98 24 26 –
mimdinare ekonomikur problemebsa da pandemiiT gamowveul Seferxebebze gTavazobT intervius ekonomikis doqtor, profesor rati abulaZesTan.
– batono rati, samwuxarod, CvenSi sakmaod dabali politikuri kulturis, maT Soris, saarCevno kulturis gamo, sazogadoeba did yuradRebas ar aqcevs arCevnebSi monawile partiebis politikur da ekonomikur programebs. Tu gaecaniT da romels gamoarCevdiT rogorc Rirebuls?
– Cveni sazogadoeba maRali socialuri da politikuri kulturiT gamoirCeva. swored sazogadoebis moTxovnaa, rom qveyanaSi amaRldes politikis standartebi, Seiqmnas ekonomikuri programebi, SemuSavdes ganviTarebis gegmebi, gatardes cvlilebebi da reformebi. arsebiTia aRiniSnos, rom partiebis mier warmodgenili programebi ufro politikuri da ekonomikuri mesijebia, vidre samoqmedo programa, rac politikuri garemos SesaZleblobebis zRvars avlebs. aRsaniSnavia akademiuri da samoqalaqo sazogadoebis Rirebuli midgomebi. amasTan, arsebuli politikuri garemos fonze, SeiZleba aRiniSnos Semdegi: qarTuli politikuri garemo ver flobs sazogadoebis ekonomikuri ganviTarebis potencials (aTwleulebia, ganviTarebadi ekonomikis mqone qveynis statusi gvaqvs), ver iTvaliswinebs xalxis saWiroebebs da ver qmnis xalxis moTxovnebis Sesabamis midgomebs; arsebuli politikuri urTierTobebi ver kravs saxelmwifos muSaobas; politikuri teqnologiebi cdilobs yuradRebis gadatanas krizisuli socialur-ekonomikuri viTarebidan, Tumca axla esec aRar gamosdis (socialur-ekonomikuri problemebis mogvarebaze saubari zedmetia); konfrontaciuli politikuri mocemuloba ver qmnis marTvis maRal standartebs; pasuxismgeblobas ar iRebs umoqmedobaze, uZraobasa da diskreditirebul marTvis procesze; politikuri teqnologiebi xels ar uSlis sazogadoebis gaxleCas; ar aCerebs sazogadoebas da bizness Soris dapirispireba-dabralebis tendencias (magaliTad, fasebis zrda bizness braldeba ekonomikuri politikis nacvlad); sakuTari mdgomareobiT kmayofilma politikam politikosebic ver Seqmna (sazogadoebidan ar warmoaCina), xelovnurad Seqmnili ki yovelTvis fuWi xarji da amaod dakarguli droa.
– mzaddeba kanonproeqti saSemosavlo gadasaxadis ganaxevrebis Sesaxeb. ramdenad realuria misi miReba?
– sanam `rames~ gavanaxevrebT, aqcizs gavauqmebT, gadasaxads SevamcirebT, sagadasaxado tvirTs SevamsubuqebT, sanacvlod unda SevqmnaT Semosavlis axali wyaroebi, gadasaxadis axali gadamxdelebi, biujetis Semosavlebi da Sevsebis resursi. valebis aRebis xarjze gatarebuli gadasaxadis Semsubuqeba-gauqmebis RonisZiebebi aris axali politikuri jgufebisa da momavali mTavrobisTvis datovebuli mZime memkvidreoba. dabalproduqtiuli ekonomikuri politika da araefeqtiani gadawyvetilebebi saqarTvelos ekonomikas amuxruWebs da winsvlas aferxebs. amitom sakanonmdeblo organoSi unda SevqmnaT iseTi saSinao da sagareo politika, saxelmwifos stimulebi da programebi, romelic gaaaqtiurebs ekonomikas, dinamikurs gaxdis qarTul biznesseqtors, warmoaCens saerTaSoriso bazris axal SesaZleblobebs.
– rogor unda davZlioT pandemiiT gamowveuli ekonomikuri krizisi, rogoria saqarTvelos mTavrobis gegmebi ekonomikis aRdgenasTan dakavSirebiT da ra axali SesaZleblobebi gauCina pandemiam saqarTvelos ekonomikas?
– dRes qveyanaSi rTuli ar aris daadgino marTvis sisustis safuZveli, romelsac arc politikuri, arc akademiuri da arc mastimulirebeli Zala ar aqvs, Tumca mis umaRles damsaxurebas krizisebi, umoqmedoba, politikuri da sakadro gaRaribeba warmoadgens. mTavrobaSi adamianur kapitals ver daagrovebT, mas xarjavT (henri kisinjeri). mTavrobaSi myofi pirebi imdenad dakavebuli arian, rom ar SeuZliaT, Seiswavlon axali mimarTulebebi. maTi goneba blokirebulia maT mier, vinc mTavrobaSi moiyvana, amas damatebuli mentaluri kedlis formireba kritikosebis Tu eqspertebis aqtivobis fonze. Sedegad, aseTi pirebi Tu fizikurad da mentalurad ver gauZleben, Semdgom sazogadoebisgan izolirebas axdenen (nytimes, 2014). amitom, arsebiTia aRiniSnos, rom ekonomikuri krizisis daZleva saWiroebs axali politikuri da ekonomikuri jgufebis Seqmnas. radgan qveyanaSi: sistema ekonomikis ganviTarebisTvis ver axorcielebs cvlilebebsa da reformebs; saxelmwifo-politikuri Tanamdebobis pirebi ver erTvebian megaproeqtebisa da globaluri proeqtebis ganxorcielebis saerTaSoriso maraTonSi; megaproeqtebi aris dasaqmebis da problemebis daZlevis ZiriTadi SesaZlebloba; saxelmwifo instituciebi inflaciur procesebs ver ebrZvian; sagadasaxado-sabiujeto gegma uTanasworobas ver Zlevs; ekonomikuri politika ver qmnis problemebTan brZolis ekonomikur jgufebs, samuSao adgilebs, Semosavlis axal wyaroebs. elituri politika qmnis mxolod ayvavebuli ekonomikis momxreebs. saqarTvelos ekonomikis SesaZleblobebis gaaqtiurebas ki gamoiwvevs politikuri energia da unarebi, efeqtiani marTva da organizeba. warsuls Cabarda mudmivad kvlevisa da msjelobis stadiaze yofna. axla mxolod praqtikuli nabijebis, reformebis da politikuri moqmedebebis droa.
– politikisa da marTvis konsaltingjgufis generalurma direqtorma aleqsi aleqsiSvilma aRniSna, rom is qveynebi, romelTac sagangebo mdgomareobis menejmentis centralizeba ver SeZles, gacilebiT uares mdgomareobaSi, kolafsSi aRmoCndnen, radgan krizisis samarTavad sxvadasxva donis mTavrobebis gansxvavebulma midgomebma da mesijebma qaosi gamoiwvia da gaarTula marTva, rac ar moxda saqarTveloSi, radgan aq procesebis centralizeba arCies – ramdenad eTanxmebiT am mosazrebas?
– pativiscemas gamovxatav nebismieri piris analizisa da Sefasebis mimarT. amasTan aRvniSnav, rom saqarTvelo kolafsisagan gadaarCines saerTaSoriso organizaciebma, msoflios wamyvanma qveynebma da saerTaSoriso Tanamegobrobam, ra Tqma unda, finansuri, programuli, organizaciuli da marTvis xelSewyobiT, aseve, sazogadoebis, kerZo da saxelmwifo seqtoris koordinirebuli moqmedebiT. saqarTveloSi arsebul viTarebas nu SevadarebT naklebad ganviTarebad qveynebSi arsebuls. nurc procentulad gavejibrebiT ganviTarebuli ekonomikis mqone qveynebs, radgan mudmivad maT vTxovT finansur Tu organizaciul mxardaWeras. amasTan, Cveni ekonomikis sidide mkveTrad CamorCeba regionis qveynebis ekonomikas, xolo ganviTarebuli ekonomikis mqone qveynebTan mimarTebiT ki saerTod daSorebuli varT drosa da sivrceSi. aRsaniSnavia ganviTarebuli ekonomikis mqone qveynebis mier gamoyofili stimulirebis paketebi, romelTa raodenoba ramdenime aTeuli miliardi dolaridan 1 trln dolaramde meryeobda qveynebis mixedviT. Sesabamisad, mizanSewonilia qveynis marTvis xarisxi SevafasoT stimulirebis paketebiT, biujetis mocemulobiT, ekonomikis sididiT, uTanasworobis masStabebiT, megaproeqtebiT, globaluri ekonomikuri aqtivobiT, geoekonomikuri da geopolitikuri aqtivobebiT.
– saqarTvelos ekonomikis zrda damokidebulia investiciebsa da warmoebaze, Sesabamisad, saqarTvelo unda Seecados Tavisufali vaWrobis pirobebSi axali bazrebis moZiebas iseT qveynebSi, rogoricaa, magaliTad, aSS, CineTi, indoeTi. . . ratom ver axerxebs amas, ra uSlis xels?
– dRes qarTuli bazari saWiroebs warmoebas, romelic teqnologiebiT da kapitaliT aris uzrunvelyofili. globalur bazarze qarTuli produqciis konkurentunarianobis zrda miRwevadia saxelmwifos finansuri xelSewyobiT, momgebiani ekonomikuri politikiT, politikaSi myofi biznesis warmomadgenlebis organizebuli aqtivobiTa da maTi globaluri biznesprocesebis formirebaSi CarTviT. saqarTvelos saeqsporto interesi unda iyos ara mxolod aziis da aSS-is bazari, aseve, laTinuri amerikis qveynebi. aRsaniSnavia, rom saeqsporto bazrebis aTvisebas Tavisi politikuri fasi aqvs da mxolod xelSekrulebebis `gaformeba~, marketingi da reklama sakmarisi ar aris. Sesabamisad, rogorc qveynis SigniT, ise qveynis gareT moqmedebisTvis energiuli da qarizmatuli politikosebi gvWirdeba.
– imdenad didia inflacia, gaizarda dolaris kursi, rom mosaxleobis umetesi nawili saSualo fenidan umweoTa fenas Seavsebs. ra gzas unda daadges mTavroba?
– qveynis ganviTarebis formulebi da mza receptebi azrs kargavs dabalproduqtiuli ekonomikuri politikis, instituciebisa da marTvis efeqtianobis gamowvevebis, Seusrulebeli struqturuli gardaqmnebis, politikuri arastabilurobisa da ucvleli politikis pirobebSi. xazgasmiT unda aRiniSnos, rom Tanamedrove gamowvevebis Sesabamis unarebs politikaSi mosvliT veravin SeiZens. rodesac qveyanaSi energiuli da qarizmatuli politikosebis deficitia, maSin mimdinareobs politikaSi ararsebuli pirebis (eqspertebi, analitikosebi, sazogadoebaSi aqtiuri pirebi) gavleniT moqmedeba, an uares SemTxvevaSi, dominirebs dablagvebuli midgomebi, personaluri SesaZleblobebis farglebSi `gadaTargmnili~ sxvisi ideebi, sazogadoebisagan izolirebis fsiqologia da oponentebisTvis ekonomikuri zianis miyenebiT gancdili `gancdebi~. jamSi, orive SemTxvevaSi, mZimdeba mosaxleobis socialuri da ekonomikuri mdgomareoba, ufasurdeba kursi da fasi, izrdeba rogorc ojaxebis, ise saxelmwifos valebi, aseve, uTanasworoba rogorc qveynis SigniT, ise – regionis qveynebTan mimarTebaSi, amitom sasicocxlod aucilebelia axali politikuri da ekonomikuri klasis Camoyalibeba.
– RaribaSvilis bolodroindel romel ekonomikur nabijs SeafasebdiT efeqturad?
– ekonomikuri nabijebisa da ekonomikuri politikis Sedegebis avtorebi arian: ekonomikur politikas mikuTvnebuli pirebi, aRmasrulebeli da sakanonmdeblo organos warmomadgenlebi, saxelmwifo institutebi da struqturebi. aRsaniSnavia, rom qveyanaSi sistema da institucia ufro meti unda iyos, vidre konkretuli piri. amitom, sanam premier-ministris aqtivobebiT vimsjelebT, obieqturi iqneba zemoaRniSnuli mravalricxovani jgufebis aqtivobebis Sefaseba da analizi. mTavrobam slaidebiT warmoadgina saqarTvelos ekonomikis grZelvadiani ganviTarebis xedva, magram is programuli ganviTarebis pirobas ver qmnis. Sedegad izrdeba umuSevroba, socialuri siduxWire, fasebi, ufasurdeba valuta. amasTan, konkretuli ekonomikuri nabijebis Sefasebas azri aqvs inkluziuri da mdgradi ganviTarebis SemTxvevaSi, qveyanaSi ki gvaqvs elituri ekonomikuri politika, sadac gaTvaliswinebuli ar aris xalxis emociebi da saWiroebebi. amitomac aRniSnuli gamowvevebis fonze, politikur garemosa da sazogadoebas Soris formirdeba erTgvari `kulturuli omi~ anu ideur interesTa konfliqti. arsebuli Sepirispireba umoqmedobasa da SesaZleblobebs Soris avlebs zRvars, dRis wesrigSi ayenebs momgebiani ekonomikuri politikis gatarebis saWiroebas, aCvenebs Zlieri saxelmwifo institutebisa da axali politikuri mocemulobis Seqmnis aucileblobas.
– ramdenad realuria saarsebo minimumis zRvari?
– oficialurad dadgenili TanxiT (216,3 lari) arsebobis SemTxvevaSi mamakacis Sromisunarianoba qveiTdeba. dRes Sromisunariani asakis mamakacis saarsebo minimumi qveynis socialur-ekonomikuri ganviTarebis donis Sesabamisia. ra ekonomikac iqmneba, is socialuri orientirebi isazRvreba. saarsebo minimumis zrda niSnavs socialuri orientirebis zrdas. saarsebo minimumi, sul mcire, 500 lari unda iyos, es ki niSnavs, rom pensia, Semweoba, socialuri gasacemlebi 500 larze naklebi ar unda iyos, risi SesaZleblobac biujets ar aqvs. samwuxarod, arsebuli politikuri da mmarTvelobiTi garemo ver qmnis pirobebs socialuri orientirebis zrdis, damsaxurebuli pensiis, jerovani xelfasis, saTanado Semweobebisa da socialuri gasacemlebiT ojaxebis uzrunvelyofisaTvis, amitom arc pensiaze gasvlas Cqarobs vinme, radgan pensiiT pensionerisTvis srulfasovani arseboba (srulfasovani kveba, medikamentebis SeZena, komunaluri gadasaxadebis gadaxda) gausaZlisia. praqtikulad ki mxolod ekonomikurad Zlieri sazogadoebis CamoyalibebiT iqmneba mZlavri saxelmwifo.
– romeli dargebis ganviTareba da investireba mogvcems ekonomikuri zrdis safuZvels?
– yoveli dargis swori da efeqtiani marTva ekonomikuri zrdis safuZvelia. TiToeuli mimarTulebis formirebiT SesaZlebelia Semosavlis axali wyaroebis Seqmna, ekonomikisa da biujetis zrda. saqarTveloSi yvela dargi xasiaTdeba mniSvnelovani saeqsporto potencialiT. aRiarebulia, rom ekonomikuri zrdis safuZvels qmnis sakadro politika, akademiuri da energiuli kadrebi. samwuxarod, saqarTvelos sakadro politika ver qmnis dargis/dargebis ganviTarebisTvis Sesabamis pirobebs, saWiro sakadro resursebs. sakadro resursis mozidvis `sistema ver cnobs~ kompetentur sakadro resurss, Sesabamisad, Zvel politikas ar aqvs dargSi gavlenebi. politikurad `arasasurveli~ kadrebis moSorebiT ar iqmneba arc dargis warmomadgenloba da arc misi ganviTareba, jamSi – arc ekonomikis ganviTarebis pirobebi. mniSvnelovania aRiniSnos, rom arsebuli gamowvevebis pirobebSi qveynis ganviTarebis ZiriTad mimarTulebas teqnologiebi da mecniereba unda warmoadgendes, rac konkretuli programuli midgomebiT unda iyos naCvenebi (da ara xedvebiT).
– ras ityviT sagareo vaWrobaze, ramdenad Semcirda? ra gaaqvs saqarTvelos ucxoeTis bazrebze pandemiis periodSi?
– saqarTvelos aqvs 10-miliardiani sagareo savaWro brunva. mimdinare wlis ianvar-seqtemberSi fiqsirdeba 22,3%-iani zrda, sadac eqsporti 2,9 mlrd aSS dolars Seadgens (24.0%-iT gaizarda), xolo importi – 7,0 mlrd aSS dolars (21,6%-iT gaizarda). saqarTvelos eqsportSi umsxvilesi sasaqonlo jgufebis xuTeuli aSS dolarSi ase gamoiyureba: spilenZis madnebi da koncentratebi (571,7 mln), msubuqi avtomobilebi (338.2 mln), feroSenadnobebi (316, 4 mln), yurZnis naturaluri Rvinoebi (166,7 mln) da spirtiani sasmelebi (105,7 mln). aTeulSi Sedis: mineraluri da mtknari wylebi (104,1 mln), samkurnalo saSualebebi dafasoebuli (72,5 mln), Txili (70,0 mln), azotovani sasuqebi (64,4 mln), trikotaJis nawarmi (49,1 mln). mocemulia 2021 wlis ianvar-seqtembris monacemebi. aRsaniSnavia, rom qveyanas aqvs saeqsporto potencialis mzardi SesaZlebloba, romelic sxvadasxva faqtoris gamo ar aqtiurdeba, arc gaaqtiurebis xelSewyoba xdeba.
– turizms pandemiis pirobebSi Tu aqvs aRdgenis Sansi?
– kvlevebi cxadyofs, rom turizmis aRdgenas da pandemiamdeli periodis mocemulobis miRebas ramdenime weli sWirdeba. amasTan, calkeuli biznessegmentisTvis es dro gansxvavebulia. magaliTad, maRali klasis sastumroebi swrafad ibruneben pandemiamdel mdgomareobas, vidre ekonomiurad mxarjvel turistze gaTvlili sastumroebi. Tumca, turistuli industriis mowyvladoba rom ar gaizrdos, politikurma muSaobam `slaidebis~ nacvlad, aqtivobis dinamika unda Seqmnas. xazgasasmelia is garemoebac, rom mmarTvelobiTi garemo ver aRwevs ekonomikis prioritetul mimarTulebebs Soris konsensuss. mTavroba turizmzea fokusirebuli, sazogadoeba ki teqnologiebisa da mecnierebis strategiul rols aRiarebs upiratesad. kvlevebi aCvenebs, rom dRes turizmi veRar pasuxobs arsebul socialur da ekonomikur gamowvevebs.
– ras daamatebdiT?
– TiToeuli moqalaqis daniSnuleba saxelmwifo miznebiT (da ara politikuri miznebiT) cxovrebaa, aRniSnuli ki moicavs saxelmwifosTvis momgebiani gadawyvetilebebis miRebas, moqmedebas da saTanado wvlils. araefeqtiani da diskreditirebuli marTvis fonis miuxedavad, TiToeuli moqalaqis moqmedebis laitmotivs mxolod saxelmwifoebrivi qmedeba unda warmoadgendes.