გიორგი კობერიძე: უკრაინაში წყდება არა მხოლოდ ევროპის უსაფრთხოების, არამედ მსოფლიო წესრიგის ბედიც
äïøï õëèåîòêò 593 50 82 69 –
ukrainisadmi ruseTis agresiam msoflio axali realobis winaSe daayena. udavoa, rom evropis geopolitikuri sistema iseTi mdgradi veRar iqneba, rogorc omis dawyebamde iyo. ruseTze Tu ar ganxorcieldeba mZlavri zewola, Tavsatexi Tavad natos wevr saxelmwifoebsac SeeqmnebaT, anu Tu ukraina damarcxda, es dasavleTis epoqaluri marcxi iqneba. amitomac amoqmedda ekonomikuri sanqciebi. garda amisa, dasavleTi SeZlebisdagvarad exmareba ukrainas saxelmwifoebriobis SenarCunebaSi. unda iTqvas, rom ara dasavleTis mxardaWera, ukrainelebs, savaraudod, gauZneldebodaT ruseTis Sekaveba, es udavoa. aRsaniSnavia isic, rom dRes garkveulwilad ukrainaSi itesteba evropis geopolitikuri sistemis mdgradoba… omis peripetiebi amis TvalsaCino magaliTia. swored am da sxva mniSvnelovan sakiTxebze vesaubrebiT 
saqarTvelos sazogadoebriv saqmeTa institutis profesor giorgi koberiZes.
– sanam ukrainaSi mimdinare omze visaubrebdeT, minda, gkiTxoT: SeeZlo Tu ara dasavleTs am omis Tavidan acileba Tundac 2014 wels ruseTisTvis mZlavri ekonomikuri sanqciebis dawesebiT?
– dasavleTs SeeZlo eswavla saqarTvelosganac, radgan swored 2008 wels kremlma oficialurad gamoxata survili, ebrZola dasavleTisa da im saerTaSoriso wesrigis winaaRmdeg, romelSic damoukidebel saxelmwifoebs sakuTari sagareo politikis ganxorcielebisa da warmarTvis saSualeba eZleodaT. kremlma saqarTveloSi agresiis dausjelobis Semdeg ganaxorciela yirimis aneqsia da omi – donbasSi. es iyo evropaSi arsebuli wesrigis rRveva. am SemTxvevaSi pasuxi iyo Seusabamod susti, amiT gaTamamebulma ruseTma ki daiwyo srulmasStabiani agresia ukrainaSi.
– garkveulwilad ukrainaSi wydeba msoflios Tu ara, evropis geopolitikuri sistemis mdgradoba. . .
– ukrainaSi wydeba ara mxolod evropis usafrTxoebis, aramed msoflio wesrigis bedic. ruseTs surs dapyrobiTi omebi kvlav normad iqces. Sesabamisad, Tuki dRes is ar SeaCeres ukrainaSi, am precedents aucileblad gamoiyeneben iseTi saxelmwifoebi, rogoricaa CineTi da irani, romelTac sakuTari eqspansionisturi politika aqvT. msgavsi politikuri midgomebis dRis wesrigSi dabruneba, pirvel rigSi, saqarTvelos interesebisTvisaa saziano.
– Tqven yoveldRiurad mimoixilavT ukrainaSi mimdinare oms. ra aCvena msoflio omis mexuTe Tvem da amJamad omis ra fazaa?
– omma aCvena, rom miuxedavad ruseTis aRmatebuli resursebisa, kremli mzad ar aRmoCnda grZelvadiani omisaTvis. ruseTi trabaxobda, rom misi armia msoflioSi meore iyo, Tumca es `meore armia~ xuTi Tvea doneckisa da luganskis raionebSi srul kontrols ver awesebs, rac yvela standartiT sisusteze mianiSnebs. rusebma sakuTari elituri samxedro nawilebi mariupolis, xarkovisa da kievis misadgomebTan dakarges. axla gamofitva grZeldeba. ukrainelebis samobilizacio resursi izrdeba, maTi wvrTna mimdinareobs, rus samxedroebs ki maRali morali da motivacia ar aqvT. isini ucxo, mtrul miwaze imyofebian, sadac maT aravin elodeba. amasTan, yvelaferi SedarebiTia – rodesac ukrainel samxedros ukeTac acvia, ukeTesi aRWurvilobac aqvs da ukeTesi kvebac, Tan samSoblos icavs, misi motivacia yovelTvis ufro maRali iqneba.
– omis dawyebis dRidan ruseTis mizani TiTqmis mTeli ukrainis dapyroba da arsebuli xelisuflebis Secvla iyo. amJamad ra aris misi mizani?
– rusebisaTvis axla mniSvnelovani mTeli donbasis anu doneckisa da luganskis raionebis dakaveba da kontrolia, magram maTTvis es Zalian rTulad misaRwev amocanad Cans. iseTi qalaqis asaRebad, rogoric severodonecki iyo, 50 dReze meti dasWirdaT. da es maSin, rodesac severodonecki sakmaod araxelsayrel geografiul da samxedro poziciaSi imyofeboda. rusebs uWirT cocxali Zalis mravali samxedro mimarTulebiT erTdroulad mobilizeba, rac Setevebis dayovnebasa da dezertirobaSic ki gamoixateba.
– dasavleTis samxedro daxmarebas ukrainisadmi am etapze rogor SeafasebT? `lend-lizi~ srulad rodis amoqmeddeba?
– rom ara dasavluri daxmareba da gansakuTrebiT ki britaneTis Tanadgoma omamde da omis pirvelive dReebSi, dRes ukrainaSi sxva situacia iqneboda. dasavlurma SeiaraRebam rusuli teqnikis didi nawili gaanadgura. axlac mZime teqnika da artileria didi raodenobiT miedineba ukrainisaken. rac mTavaria, dinamikaa dadebiTi – ukrainis gadaiaraReba daCqarebuli wesiT grZeldeba maSin, rodesac rusebi ukve T-34 tankebis gamoyvanas apireben.
– TiTqmis mTeli msoflio gmobs ruseTis agresias, uweseben sanqciebs. am mimarTebiT dasavleTi realurad ramdenad principuli da Tanmimdevrulia ukrainis realuri mxardaWeris TvalsazrisiT? Cndeba STabeWdileba, rom msoflio daiRala ukrainis omiT da cdilobs, es qveyana kompromisze daiyolios. . .
– is saxelmwifoebi, romelsac samxedro da ekonomikur sferoSi yvelaze didi wona aqvT, dganan ukrainis gverdiT. saubari maqvs did britaneTze, aSS-ze, poloneTsa da SvedeTze. isini qmnian dRes samxedro mimarTulebiT mTavar dRis wesrigs. rac Seexeba kontinentur evropas, aq arc germaniaa da arc safrangeTi ruseTis agresiis mxardamWeri, ubralod, maT ruseTis marcxSi didi fasis gadaxda ar surT. amasTan, dro ruseTis winaaRmdeg muSaobs. nel-nela amerikulma gaTxevadebulma gazma daiwyo rusuli gazis Canacvleba evropaSi. germaniaSi kvlav apireben atomuri energiis dabrunebas. matulobs eleqtromanqanebis raodenobac. ruseTi evropis benzingasamarTi sadguri rom iyo, amaze adrec xumrobdnen dasavleTSi, axla ki mis gareSec SeeZlebaT arseboba.
– rogorc cnobilia, ukraina TiTqmis yvela frontze utevs ruseTs, magaliTad, poloneTisa da baltiispireTis qveynebTan erTad, ruseTis winaaRmdeg haagaSi sarCeli Seitana, aSS-is prezidentma ki putins samxedro damnaSave uwoda. . . rogor SeiZleba ganviTardes movlenebi?
– axlandeli ruseTi hgavs iugoslaviis daSlis SedegebiT gaRizianebul serbeTs, romelsac didi serbeTis imperiis idea hqonda da mudmivad omebs awarmoebda mezoblebTan. rogorc mis mmarTvel miloSeviCs ezRo haagaSi, iseve SeiZleba aRmoCndes kremli izolirebuli danarCeni civilizebuli msofliodan. rTuli saTqmelia, ruseTSi surT Tu ara CrdiloeT koreis lider kim Cen inis msgavsad Camoyalibebuli putinis xilva.
– dawesebuli sanqciebi marTlac mravlismTqmelia, Tumca kremli jerjerobiT ukan daxevas ar apirebs. dasavleTs TadarigSi ra berketebi rCeba?
– sanqciebi nela, magram muSaobs. ruseTma 100 wlis ganmavlobaSi pirvelad ganicada defolti. asiaTasobiT dasaqmebulma rusma dakarga samsaxuri. amdenive Sromisunarianma moqalaqem datova qveyana.dRes TviTkmari saxelmwifo ar arsebobs. arc ruseTia aseTi, Sesabamisad, sanqciebi nel-nela, magram kidev ufro mkacrad imoqmedebs.
– evrokomisiam 2023 wlamde gadaswia saqarTvelosTvis kandidatis statusis miniWeba. es raze mianiSnebs? da aqve Tanmdevi kiTxva: amas winaT Cvens qveyanaSi gamarTulma mitingebma ra cxadyo?
– saqarTvelos xelisuflebas unda gaekeTebina meti da Seesrulebina yvela is nakisri valdebuleba, romlebic mas kandidatis statuss moutanda. mxolod statusi ki ar aris mniSvnelovani, aramed is reformebi, romlebsac dasavleTi saqarTvelos xelisuflebas sTxovda da sTxovs, rom gaataros. pirvel rigSi, es Cveni qveynis moqalaqeebs moutanda sargebels. iqneboda meti usafrTxoeba, meti gamWvirvaloba, aRarc politikuri klanebi iarsebebda da aRarc saxelmwifo imuSavebda ramdenime adamianis interesebidan gamomdinare. saqarTvelos xelisuflebas Tu aqvs survili, saxelmwifos interesebidan gamomdinare imoqmedos, es erTi weli yvelaferi unda akeTos reformebisTvis. meore mxriv, rTuli saTqmelia, ra iqneba erT weliwadSi. mimdinare weli CvenTvis SesaZleblobis fanjarasaviT iyo, 2023 weli rogori iqneba, ucnobia.
– kvlav ukrainas davubrundeT: misTvis omis sasurvelad dasruleba ra faqtorebze iqneba damokidebuli?
– ukrainis omi dasruldeba maSin, rodesac ruseTi mixvdeba, rom omis warmoebisTvis aRar aqvs arc neba da arc sakmarisi samxedro Zalebi. sabWoTa kavSiri, romelic ruseTze bevrad aRmatebuli iyo resursebiT, rodesac mixvda, rom avRaneTSi oms veRar igebda, gamovida. arada, sabWoTa kavSirs 10 weliwadSi imis naxevari samxedro daeRupa, ramdenic ruseTma ukrainaSi xuT TveSi dakarga. oms mxolod raodenobrivi resursebiT ver moigeb. elituri samxedro nawilebi rusebma kievTan, mariupolsa da xarkovTan dakarges. drosTan erTad igi mets kargavs da cotas iRebs. es iseTi dinamikaa, rom SeiZleba kremlSic dafiqrdnen amaze.
– dabolos, ra gavlena eqneba am omis Sedegebs msoflioze da, kerZod, saqarTveloze?
– saqarTvelosaTvis ruseTis marcxi kritikulad mniSvnelovania. ar unda dagvaviwydes, rom ruseTis gverdiT ibrZvian saqarTvelos okupirebuli teritoriebidan wayvanili separatistebic. Sesabamisad, dRes rusebis marcxi saqarTvelos gamarjvebaa, separatistebisTvis ki Wkuis saswavli, rom ruseTi daumarcxebeli ar aris da, adre Tu gvian, saqarTvelodanac mouwevs gasvla.
