მამუკა არეშიძე: . . .ან არიან აბსოლუტური, კლინიკური იდიოტები, კამერების წინ თავში რომ ურტყამენ ქალებს, ბავშვებს და ჟურნალისტებს, ან – სპექტაკლია
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ar sruldeba saprotesto aqciebi da rac ufro Zlierdeba fizikuri dapirispirebebi mxareTa Soris, miT meti adamiani uerTdeba opozicias. 24 saaTis ganmavlobaSi trialebs socialur qselebSi daSavebulTa, nacemTa, dazaralebulTa videorgolebi, rac aqamde mSvidad myofi mosaxleobis umetesi nawilis gabrazebas iwvevs da gahyavs quCaSi. zogierTs bunebrivad uCndeba kiTxva, ratom iqcevian Zalovanebi ise, TiTqos specialurad aRizianeben qveyanas, xolo bavSvebis da qalebis cemiT, gamwarebuli dedebis cremlebiT kidev ufro did saprotesto talRas agoreben. opoziciam weli gaimagra, acxadebs, rom quCebSi msvlelobebi, galeqsili urcxvi ginebebi, uwmawuri SeZaxilebi da molotovis koqteilebi Tavad studentebis arCevania, isini liderebis gareSe, stiqiurad moqmedeben, Tavad maragdebian piroteqnikiT Tu molotovis koqteilebiT da Tavad irCeven, ra meTodebiT ibrZolon evropisken mimaval gzaze dasabruneblado, anu opoziciis liderebi xels ibanen pasuxismgeblobisgan. gTavazobT intervius eqspert mamuka areSiZesTan, romelic saintereso paralelebs avlebs warsulTan da Secdomebis gameorebis realur safrTxes aanonsebs.
– rogorc yofili Jurnalisti, ra komentars gaakeTebT Jurnalistebis sastikad cemis faqtze?
– momxre var, kanonis farglebSi iyos rogorc momitingeebis, ise policielebis saqcieli. saxelmwifo unda idges kanonze da samoqalaqo pasuxismgeblobaze. erT-erTi Tu dasustdeba, maSin mas saZirkveli ecleba da saxelmwifos warmonaqmns emsagavseba. mokled, arc erTi mxridan ar unda dauSvan Zalis, uflebebis gadameteba, Tavze gadaxtoma da a.S. samwuxarod, orive mxaris saqcielSi igrZnoba „sxvisi xeli“ (sxva saxelmwifos mier dasaxul amocanebs rom asruleben) da orive mxares arian adamianebi, romlebic ideis irgvliv gaerTianebuli dadgnen erTmaneTis pirispir. anu policielebSic arian, kanons rom pirnaTlad icaven da momitingeebSic – saqarTvelos keTildReobis gamo rom gadades Tavi.
– polarizacia dRiTi dRe mZafrdeba. . .
– maxsendeba 1991 wlis dekembri, diax, yvelaferi meordeba. maSin `mxare~ viyavi, rac dRemde ver mipatiebia TavisTvis. ver gavTvaleT me da Cemma Taobam, rom es yvelaferi sisxls moitanda. axlac, tragediamde erTi nabijia praqtikulad, es nabiji ukve gadadgmulia. maSinac ase iyo. . . ras warmovidgendiT, win ra gveloda da ramxela tkivilis gadatana mogviwevda. kargad iciT, maSin vin gaixara. . . axlac sxva gaixarebs saqarTveloSi datrialebuli tragediiT. es qveyana suyvelas fexebze hkidia, mteri iqneba Tu fariseveli moyvare. yvelas unda es teritoria qarTvelebis gareSe. kargi geopolitikuri sivrcea. icvleba msoflioSi yvelaferi, teritoriebis gadanawileba mimdinareobs da aqedan gamomdinare, Zalian momgebiani pozicia gviWiravs. swored amitom gaCnda amxela interesi da aRmovCndiT am gadanawilebis epicentrSi. Soreul da axlobel mezobels, partniors Tu mters surs, maqsimalurad akontrolos es sivrce da amisTvis qmnian saqarTveloSi gavlenis jgufebs. ase iyo 30 wlis ganmavlobaSi. es yvelaferi unda gavaanalizoT, gaumarTlebel dapirispirebebSi, siZulvilis xelovnurad Seqmnil platformaze ki ar unda SevakvdeT erTmaneTs, aqeT-iqiT gavixedoT da davakvirdeT, ra xdeba irgvliv. . . simarTle giTxraT, isic vici, rom Cemi es laparaki wylis nayvaa, imdenadaa polarizebuli sazogadoeba am etapze. gaxsovT, albaT, msgavsi polarizebis gansamuxtad eqimma gia abesaZem Tavi rom daiwva. Sedegi?! – nuli! axlac ase iqneba, tyuilad vlaparakob mec da tyuilad ixarjebiT – Tqvenc, Sedegi axlac nulis toli iqneba. . . iqneb gazviadebuli naTqvami gamomdis, magram imitom vambob, minda yvelam gaacnobieros mTavrobasa Tu opoziciaSi, rom Zalian frTxilad unda iyvnen, raTa saTqmelic Tqvan da qveyanac ar daangrion. cxadia, es momitingeebsac exebaT, romelTa nawili marTlac ar emorCileba arc erT mxares da stiqiurad mihyveba tragediisken mimarTul procesebs.
– opozicia mxrebSi gaiSala daZabulobis eskalaciiT da meti agresiisken mouwodebs momitingeebs, amitom stiqiurs naklebad hgavs maTi qmedebebi. . .
– rasakvirvelia, asea, opozicia sakuTar politikur miznebs axorcielebs stiqiurad quCebSi gadmodinebuli, gabrazebuli xalxis xeliT. msgavsi ram bunebrivad aRiqmeba am etapze, magram Sen rom xelisufleba xar, Sesabamisad unda moiqce. Zalian mniSvnelovania is faqti, rom nebismier antisaxelmwifoebriv qmedebas daupirispiro saRi azri, Tundac amisTvis kompromisuli nabiji gadadga. me axla receptebis gamoweras ar daviwyeb, radgan mainc aravin mogvismens, vinc politikaSia, Tavisi Tavi yvelaze Wkviani hgonia. . . faqtia, rom raRac iseTi unda moifiqron, rac am dapirispirebas Seanelebs. kompromiss, erTmaneTisken garkveuli nabijebis gadadgmas iTxovs sazogadoebis umetesi nawili. mosmena, daTmoba da erToblivi gadawyvetilebebis miRebaa aucilebeli. maSin kompromisul jgufebSi mec viyavi da Zalian kargad maxsovs, vijeqiT grZel magidasTan – Cven Cvensas vlaparakobdiT, isini – Tavisas da. . . erTmaneTs ar vusmendiT, araTu ver vigebdiT, saerTod ar vusmendiT. . . magram es erTxel xom gamoviareT?!. im grZeli magididan rom avdeqiT da gareT gamovediT, erTmaneTs srola davuwyeT, xolo es omi riTi damTavrda, yvelasTvis cnobilia.
– samwuxarod, ar axsovs bevrs, arada, zustad igive scenariT viTardeba movlenebi. . .
– ra vqna, me vlaparakob, vixseneb, vyvebi. . . besarion guguSvilis kabinetSi xdeboda molaparakeba. . . iqiT deputatebi isxdnen, ar minda axla maTi saxelebis xseneba, dadgeba magis droc. . . swored Cveni mouTmenlobis da SeuTanxmeblobis gamo, tragediiT dasrulda yvelaferi. axlac tragedia datrialdeba. . . Tu gnebavT, gavixsenoT qronologiurad: 1991 wlis 2 seqtembers daRvrilma pirvelma sisxlma ganapiroba aTasi ubedureba. maSin `pirveli arxis~ Jurnalisti gaxldiT da aqciebi gavmarTeT 2 seqtembris movlenebis gamo. maxsovs, televizia gaifica, isic maxsovs, ra xdeboda qalaqSi. 2 seqtembris sisxlis patara gubeebidan zRvebi (samoqalaqo dapirispireba, omebi afxazeTsa Tu samaCabloSi) miviReT. erTi da igive meordeba saqarTvelos istoriaSi da es yovelTvis mTavrdeba samoqalaqo dapirispirebiT, sadac yovelTvis saqarTvelo marcxdeba. am movlenebis ukan me yovelTvis sxvis xels vxedav.
– vin isargeblebs Cveni dapirispirebebiT da am msxverpliT?
– aq mudmivad iSveren xels sawinaaRmdego mimarTulebiT, opozicia – ruseTisken, samTavrobo seqtori – dasavleTisken. . . mudam mavani sargeblobs qveyanaSi Seqmnili rTuli viTarebiT. Zalian kargad maxsovs, rogor moxda galis movlenebis provocireba 1998 wels, maxsovs, afxazeTSi rogor daigo xafangi gilaevis laSqrobis konteqstSi. `vardebis revoluciac~ is movlenaa, romelic sxvagan daigegma. mere iyo 2005 wlis konfliqti da 2008 wlis agvistos omi, romlebSic yovelTvis monawileobdnen sxva Zalebi, Cveni qveyana dangrevamde rom mihyavdaT. . . da me geubnebiT, yvela isargeblebs, is Cveni mezoblebic, axla megobrebi rom gvgonia. momitingeebi ise arian CarTuli qveynis Sidapolitikur procesebSi, rom gareT ver amCneven, ra xdeba.
– . . .da ra xeba gareT?
– figuralurad rom vTqvaT, gareT am wuTSi mimdinareobs osmaleTis imperiis aRdgena, yovel SemTxvevaSi, im sazRvrebSi, romelSic manamde iyo, rasac miesalmeba mTeli Turquli sazogadoeba da media. gavixsenoT, nu dagvaviwydeba is safrTxeebi, rac Casafrebulia. ar minda axla amaze gadavitano aqcenti, magram unda vicodeT erTi ram, saqarTvelos ar hyavs moyvare da megobari, mas mxolod droebiTi partniorobis imedi unda hqondes, radgan rogorc ki im `partnioris~ intresebSi CavjdebiT, maSinve mogvindomebs saTavisod. amitom ar unda moviqceT ise, rom im aragulwrfel moyvares xelSi CavugdoT es qveyana martivad. Tu brZolaa, maSin brZola iyos, magram erTmaneTis winaaRmdeg ki ara, im gamowvevebis winaaRmdeg, saqarTvelos winaSe rom dgas.
– isev momtingeebs da maT darbevebs davubrundeT. . .
– isev vityvi, rom amis gamarTleba SeuZlebelia, arc erTi saRad moazrovne ar dauWers da arc uWers mxars, magram bevr rameSi, piradad me, eWvi mepareba. . . TavSi rom urtyamdnen, ori kamera iRebda am incidents da vin aris debili, daijeros? gamodis, idiotebi arian, am ori kameris win am sadamsjelo aqts rom sCadiodnen. isRa darCaT, motrialebuliyvnen, gaeRimaT da kameris mimarTulebiT mokiTxvebi gadaecaT axloblebisTvis. Tanamedrove teqnologiebis epoqaSi ra unda im adamianebis amocnobas, xelovnuri inteleqtis erT-erTi daniSnuleba zustad es aris. martivad SeuZlia aseTi amocanis gamoSifrva, anu, speqtaklis elementebi igrZnoba mTel am videorgolebSi. an arian absoluturi, klinikuri idiotebi, kamerebis win TavSi rom urtyamen qalebs, bavSvebs da Jurnalistebs, an – speqtaklia. sxvanairi axsna ver gamovZebne. es SabaTis Ramis epizodze vTqvi. manamde, policielebi TavSi fexs urtyamen adamians. saSineleba rom aris, rad unda Tqma. isic saSinelebaa, rogor umizneben da esvrian policielebs foierverkebs Tu molotovis koqteilebs momitingeebi. . . es yvelaferi aris procesi, razec bevrjer vilaparakeT, magram yvelaze didi safrTxe win gvelodeba, rodesac tragediamde mivalT.
– tragediaSi samoqalaqo oms gulisxmobT?
– diax, qarTvelis mier qarTvelis sisxlis daRvras vgulisxmob da im fantasmagoriul, uzarmazar naprals, romelic dRiTi dRe Rrmavdeba da mTel qarTul sazogadoebas gasdevs. SeiZleba Cvens patara qveyanaSi iyos ori banaki, romelic erTmaneTs dasanaxad ver itans? siZulvilis enam qveyana moicva da ojaxebSi daisadgura, deda Svils ver ugebs da mama – babuas. . . erTmaneTs ar usmenen da jiqur miiweven ufskrulisken dasaRupad. . . mTel am viTarebaSi, yvelaze gamaRizianebelia mesame kategoria, romelic Cveul cxovrebas agrZelebs, restoranSic dadis, dasasvenebladac miemgzavreba da Sopingebsac ar iklebs. . . isev is xdeba, rac `maSin~, TviTmfrinaviT cxedrebi rom CamohqondaT afxazeTidan, dubaiSi mifrinavdnen savaWrod. . . rac xdeba, aris eris gaxleCa da am situacias Cveni mtrebi gamoiyeneben. mere xelisuflebam daaSava Tu opoziciam, aravis emaxsovreba, sabolood qveyana dazaraldeba.

