,,ორპოლუსიან ბრძოლაში მმართველ პარტიას გამარჯვების მეტი შანსი აქვს”
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2024 wlis saparlamento arCevnebamde dros rom fexi auwyon da kargi Sedegebi moipovon, partiebi amisTvis ukve amTaviTve zrunaven. erTiani xedva da qveynis ukeTesi mermisisTvis mizanmimarTuli moqmedeba am etapze is aucilebeli pirobaa, yvela partias rom unda axasiaTebdes, miT ufro, roca saSiS geopolitikur realobaSi gviwevs cxovreba. rogor aqvT es gacnobierebuli qarTvel politikosebs, adamianebs, romlebsac surT, rom momavalSi Cveni cxovrebis kanonmdeblebad mogvevlinon? ramdenad mosalodnelia didi opoziciuri gaerTianeba? ra aris umTavresi am etapze? kursi, saiTkenac miviswrafviT, ras moiTxovs Cvengan? rogor politikas vatarebT evrointegraciisTvis, ra problemebi iCens Tavs da ra gza arsebobs maT gadasawyvetad? am da sxva aqtualur sakiTxebze Tavis Tvalsazriss `lelo saqarTvelosTvis~ aWaris organizaciis erT-erTi lideri da amave dros baTumis sakrebulos wevri vaJa darCia gvTavazobs
– rogor daaxasiaTebdiT qveyanaSi arsebul viTarebas?
– qveyanaSi arasaxarbielo ekonomikuri da politikuri viTarebaa. guldasawyvetia Cveni xelisuflebis antiukrainuli pozicia da ruseTTan enis moCleqiT saubari, miT ufro ruseTidan Camosuli moqalaqeebisaTvis gamartivebuli savizo reJimis amoqmedeba, rac ar Seesabameba Cvens erovnul interesebs.
– xelisuflebis warmomadgenlebi sxvadasxva sakiTxze opoziciis braldebebs usafuZvlos uwodeben da dasZenen, rom qveynis winsvlisTvis qmediT nabijebs dgamen. . .
– yvela saerTaSoriso Sexvedraze Cvens xelisuflebas aSkarad akritikeben ruseTTan dakavSirebuli politikis gamo. es pragmatuli, argaRizianebis politika ruseTTan mimarTebiT saqarTvelos kargs arafers uqadis, amis yvelaze mkafio gamovlineba iyo is, rom mmarTveli partia orbanTan (ungreTis premieri) diTirambebis politikis gamo mokveTes evropuli socialisturi banakidan, maT ar hyavT lobisti evroparlamentSi. es sagangaSoa miT umetes, roca qveyana kandidatis statusis molodinSia.
– sxvaTa Soris, mmarTveli gundi acxadebs, rom premier-ministr RaribaSvilis viziti briuselSi nayofieri iyo da saqarTvelo-evrokavSiris urTierTobis gaRrmavebas emsaxureboda. . .
– `qarTuli ocneba~ yvela Sexvedraze acxadebs, rom misi kursi dasavluria, Tumca qmedebebi sapirispiros amtkicebs. Cveni gundi da sxvadasxva opoziciuri partia yoveldRiurad xvdeba dasavlel partniorebs. isini sajarod amboben, rom am politikiT saqarTvelos kandidatis statusis miReba gauWirdeba. mohyavT magaliTebi: sanqcirebuli rusuli aviakompaniebi, romlebic saqarTveloSi dadian, maT Soris afxazeTSi da es Cveni regioni uweriaT rogorc calke qveyana, garda amisa, sagangaSo iyo lavrovis ojaxis wevrebis qorwili saqarTveloSi, kadirovelebis viziti qveyanaSi da a. S.
– mmarTveli partiis wevrebi opoziciis zemoaRniSnul braldebebs usafuZvlos uwodeben, Tanac dasZenen, rom opozicia ar aris dainteresebuli, saqarTvelom miiRos kandidatis statusi, ras fiqrobT?
– piriqiT, sworedac rom dainteresebuli varT. is gundi, romelSic var, ufro kompetenturi, kreatiuli da kargi saxeebiTaa dakompleqtebuli. Cveni gundis mizania, mokle vadaSi dasavluri integracia, pirvel rigSi, kandidatis statusis miReba, Semdeg – wevroba. Tu am mizans biZina ivaniSvili Tavis gundTan erTad miaRwevs, mivesalmebi. mimaCnia, rom vinc am qveynis dasavlur integracias, kandidatis statusis miRebas ar eTanxmeba, qveynis mteria! ar aqvs mniSvneloba, vin iqneba – xelisuflebis Tu opoziciis warmomadgeneli.
– amas winaT parlamentma mmarTveli partiis ZalisxmeviT miiRo deoligarqizaciis kanoni miuxedavad veneciis komisiis uaryofiTi poziciisa, Tqveni azri amis Sesaxeb. . .
– mosalodneli iyo mmarTveli gundis msgavsi nabiji. evrokavSiris mxridan 12-punqti rom Sedga, es erT-erT yvelaze rTul punqtad miiCnies. evroparlamentis yvela daskvna Tu rezolucia xazs usvamda, rom kanoni Seexeboda biZina ivaniSvils, Tumca `qarTulma ocnebam~ igi represiul kanonproeqtad gadaakeTa. amis magaliTia mediamenejerebze Tavdasxma, maT Soris Cveni partiis liderebze. ganacxades, rom visac fuli aqvs da surs politikaSi mosvla, mis CarTulobas swored es kanonproeqti daaregulirebs, Tumca yvelam viciT, rom sazogadoebaze ekonomikuri, finansuri gavlenis moxdena yvelaze metad biZina ivaniSvils SeuZlia da es kanonproeqti ar iqneba saerTaSoriso organizaciebisgan aRiarebuli manam, sanam konkretulad ar Seexeba araformalur mmarTvels anu ivaniSvils.
– mmarTveli partia acxadebs, rom ivaniSvili politikaSi ar ereva. . .
– xelisufleba bevr rames ambobs, kerZod, Turme qveyana aRorZinda da a. S. yvelam icis, rom xelisufleba ivaniSvilisgan araformalurad imarTeba.
– drodadro vxedavT, rom prezidenti xelisuflebis warmomadgenlebs akritikebs antidasavluri ritorikis gamo, es risi maniSnebelia?
– zogadad, mmarTveli partia sakuTar kadrebTanac ver megobrobs. jer aRmerTebdnen qalbaton salomes, plakatebze mis magivrad iyvnen gamofenili… igive iyo gaxarias SemTxvevaSi, jer yvelaze magari ministri iyo, axla narkomanad moixsenieben, anu moqmedic da yofili maRalCinosnebi, vinc aug sityvas mmarTvel partiaze ityvis, maTTvis mteria. saqarTvelos prezidenti salome zurabiSvili aris erTaderTi adamiani xelisuflebidan, vinc dasavleTSi swor mesijebs aJRerebs, Tumca Sida politikur doneze konkretul meqanizmebs, rac mas gaaCnia (Tundac igive nika gvaramias SewyalebasTan dakavSirebiT), ar iyenebs. es Cvens moqalaqeebs afiqrebinebs, rom saqarTvelos prezidents drodadro ivaniSvili alaparakebs. arada, mniSvnelovania, prezidentma mis xelT arsebuli qmediTi meqanizmebi gamoiyenos.
– arc opoziciaSia saqme kargad, Tqvenma liderma mamuka xazaraZem ganacxada, rom unda Seiqmnas didi opoziciuri gaerTianeba `nacionaluri moZraobis~ gareSe. . .
– `nacionalur moZraobasTan~, mis axal menejmentTan Cveni partiis damokidebuleba axali ar aris. `nacmoZraobis~ axali Tavmjdomare levan xabeiSvili cota xnis win kezeraSvils kriminals uwodebda, axla sxvanairad fiqrobs. aseTi feriscvaleba amomrCevels abnevs. Cven gvinda, SevqmnaT alternatiuli polusi, alternatiuli centri `nacmoZraobis~ gareSe. udavoa, rom `nacionaluri moZraoba~ aris polusi, Sesabamisad, roca alternatiuli polusis SeTavazeba gvinda sazogadoebisTvis, polusis polusTan gaerTianeba swori ar iqneba. Cveni mizania, rom prodasavlurma opoziciurma liderebma gadadgan qmediTi nabijebi, maT Soris cnobil 12 punqtTan dakavSirebiT da 2024 wels saarCevno ubnebze xmebis dacva uzrunvelvyoT. visac CvenTan surs TanamSromloba, vepatiJebiT am brZolaSi efeqturi SedegisTvis, xolo `nacionaluri moZraobis~ axal menejmentTan TanamSromlobas ar vapirebT, radgan warmoudgenelia siaxleebze gqondes pretenzia da vano merabiSvilTan da daviT kezeraSvilTan imegobro.
– urTierTbraldebebi opoziciaSi araxalia, magaliTad, xatia dekanoiZe `nacmoZraobas~ mkacrad akritikebs, Tavis mxriv levan xabeiSvili acxadebs, rom rac dekanoiZe partiidan wavida, `POpost tv~-is da `imedis~ ritorikiT alaparakda. . .
– ara mgonia, rom xatia dekanoiZe is adamiani iyos, romelsac mmarTvel partiasTan garigebaSi SeiZleba dasdo brali. adamianebs, romlebsac `nacionaluri moZraobis~ politika ar moswonT, ratomRac moRalateebad Tvlian, arada, rogor SeiZleba mogwondes adamiani, romelzec `bibisi~ acxadebs, rom pensionerebs Zarcvavs, aseve rogor SeiZleba mogwondes adamiani, romelsac 7 noemberi awevs zurgze. araformaluri mmarTvelobis Canacvleba isev araformaluri mmarTvelobiT miuRebelia, mTavaria sajaro politikis keTeba sajarod.
– vxedavT, rom `lelo saqarTvelosTvis~ aqtiurobs, uqmad arc `strategia aRmaSenebelia~, Tqven partias rogor warmoudgenia didi opoziciuri gaerTianeba?
– Cemi azriT, koaliciaze saubari umjobesia arCevnebis Semdeg, gamomdinare iqidan, rom konkretuli identoba partiam unda gamokveTos, unda vicodeT, memarjvenea, memarcxenea, Tu centristulia, ra politikas atarebs sagareo kursis kuTxiT. vfiqrob, arCevnebis Semdeg prodasavluri opoziciis liderebi unda dasxdnen, arCevnebis Sedegebidan gamomdinare, unda gadainawilon xelisufleba, unda Tqvan, – Cven, pirobiTad, 100 dReSi gavakeTebT imas, rom es qveyana miiRebs kandidatis statuss, gavaumjobesebT socialur sakiTxebs da a. S. garda amisa, partiebs unda gvqondes erTgvari meqanizmi, rom roca koalicias SevqmniT da romeliRac partiis konkretuli nabiji ar mogvewoneba, unda SegveZlos am partiisTvis imis Tqma, rom mzad var, koalicia dagiSalo. mokled, koalicia niSnavs urTierTSeTanxmebas sxvadasxva sakiTxze, swored am principiT vimoqmedebT Cven.
– rogorc viciT, saarCevno kanonmdeblobiT koaliciebis Seqmna saarCevnod akrZalulia, am mxriv opozicias ra strategia aqvs SemuSavebuli?
– teqnikuri ambebi 2024 wlis arCevnebTan dakavSirebiT Zalian problemuria, maT Sorisaa saarCevno barieris sakiTxi. iciT, rom ori mosmeniT orprocentiani barieri gasulia parlamentSi da SeiZleba, mesame mosmeniTac gavides… SeiZleba mmarTvel partias dasWirdes orprocentiani barieris damtkiceba, rom gaiyvanos parlamentSi sateliti partiebi. am mxriv Cven SegviZlia gamoviyenoT sxvadasxva meqanizmi, magaliTad, an `lelos~ siaSi, unda SeviyvanoT sxvadasxva partiis liderebi da wevrebi, anda Cveni liderebi Caeweron sxva partiis siaSi, erTaderTi alternativa aris is, rom `daiZinos~ yvela partiam da axali erTobis magaliTi SevqmnaT, kerZod, pirobiTad, yvela 39 saarCevno nomriT gavalT arCevnebze. samomavlod, Tu opoziciuri partiebis erToba gamoikveTeba, es unda iyos axali ganacxadi, axali saxeliT, axali centriT `nacionaluri moZraobis~ gareSe.
– momavali arCevnebi orpolusiani Tu mravalpolusiani iqneba?
– Cven imitom davpatiJeT opoziciuri partiebi, rom alternatiuli polusi gaCndes qveyanaSi, orpolusian brZolaSi mmarTvel partias gamarjvebis meti Sansi eqneba. es yvela etapze dadasturda. amis magaliTia im adamianebis wina planze gamosvla, romlebic wina xelisuflebis pirobebSi cud raRacebTan asocirdebian. vinc zemoT vaxseneT, am dapirispirebis poluss zrdis. Cven gvinda, rom axali alternatiuli centri am adamianebisgan gaTavisuflebuli iyos da viRacam ar gviTxras, rom maTTan varT afelirebuli.
– eqspertTa nawili Tvlis, rom mmarTvel partias xels aZlevs `nacmoZraobis~ SenarCuneba aseTi saxiT. . .
– cxadia, asea! bolo wlebSi xelisufleba arCevnebSi mxardaWeras inarCunebs zustad im fonze, rom `nacmoZraoba~ hyavs konkurentad, xalxs ar unda `nacionaluri moZraobis~ xelisuflebaSi dabruneba. alternatiuli centri unda iZleodes imis saSualebas, rom am gabrazebuli eleqtoratis xma maTTan, anu mesame centrTan wamovides. es polusi unda warmoiqmnas da amas yvelaze kargad prodasavluri erToba SeZlebs.
– saparlamento da adgilobrivma arCevnebma cxadyo, rom mosaxleoba indiferentulia, ras akeTebs Tqveni partia, rom pasiuri amomrCeveli arCevnebze mivides?
– Cven vmuSaobT Zalian bevri mimarTulebiT, maT Soris axalgazrduli banakebis kuTxiTac, vcdilobT, rom garkveuli segmentebi davainteresoT politikaSi CarTviT. cxadia, rac ufro meti iqneba aqtivoba arCevnebze, metia Sansi, rom mmarTveli Zala xelisuflebaSi ar darCes.
– sagareo sakiTxsac SevexoT, eqsperti vaxtang ZabiraZe acxadebs, rom Tu kandidatis statusi ar mogvaniWes, saqarTveloSi destabilizacia moxdeba, ras fiqrobT?
– es SeiZleba utrirebuli naTqvami iyos, Tumca Tu kandidatis statusi ver miviReT, amas, cxadia, protesti mohyveba. mmarTveli partia ukve amazec fiqrobs da iseT politikas atarebs, rom fiaskos SemTxvevaSi opozicia daadanaSaulos. konkretul 12 punqtTan dakavSirebiT xelisufleba acxadebs, rom deoligarqizaciis kanonis garda yvela Seasrula, arada, erTaderTi, rac Sesrulebulia, saxalxo damcvelis arCevaa.
– dabolos, ruseT-ukrainis omi axal fazaSi gadavida, ukrainuli armia warmatebul kontrSetevas axorcielebs. ramdenad mosalodnelia, rom ruseTma agresia sxva qveyniskenac mimarTos?
– udavoa, rom ukraina Tanmimdevrulad aRwevs warmatebas frontze, mas mTeli msoflio exmareba. am omis Sedegi yvela SemTxvevaSi iqneba ruseTis damarcxeba, ukraina ki gaimarjvebs. gamarjvebaSi vgulisxmob yirimis da doneckis regionis srulad gaTavisuflebas, ekonomikuri problemebi ruseTSi saxezea, arsebobs safrTxe, rom kremlma axali agresia ganaxorcielos mezobeli qveynebis mimarT. am mxriv putins salaparako ar unda mivceT (rusulenovani mosaxleobis dacva – samezobloSi), amitom aris saxifaTo ruseTis moqalaqeebis Semosvla qveyanaSi. SeiZleba putinma sakuTari moqalaqeebis dacvis sababiT morigi agresia wamoiwyos saqarTveloSi da gaimyaros avtoriteti ruseTSi. swored amis saSualeba ar unda misces Cvenma xelisuflebam, Tumca aqeTken gadadgmul konkretul nabijebs jer ver vxedav.