„რატომ არის ისრაელის ირანზე თავდასხმა თავდაცვა, გაუგებარია. . .“

irma cecxlaZe

is­ra­e­lis Tav­dac­vis Za­le­bis gan­cxa­de­biT, be­i­ruT­Si, „hez­bo­las“ erT-erTi me­Ta­u­ris lik­vi­da­cia gan­xor­ci­el­da. su­he­il hu­se­in hu­se­i­ni, ro­me­lic „hez­bo­las“ lo­gis­ti­kur Stab-bi­nas xel­mZRva­ne­lob­da da „hez­bo­las“ ji­ha­dis sab­Wos wev­ri iyo, is­ra­e­lis sa­ha­e­ro ie­ri­Sis Se­de­gad da­i­Ru­pa. „hu­se­i­ni“ iran­sa da „hez­bo­las“ So­ris ia­ra­Ris ga­da­ce­mi­sas mniS­vne­lo­van rols Ta­ma­Sob­da da „hez­bo­las“ qve­da­na­yo­febs So­ris ia­ra­Ris ga­na­wi­le­ba­ze iyo pa­suxismgebeli. yoveldRiurad iZabeba viTareba iran-israelis konfliqtSi, rasac israelis permier-ministri beniamin neTaniahu „regionSi usafrTxoebis realobis cvlilebas“ uwodebs. mi­si­ve TqmiT, „es aris omi Cve­ni ar­se­bo­bis­Tvis, omi aRor­Zi­ne­bis­Tvis“.

am konfliqtis wina periods rom gadavxedoT, pir­ve­li sa­ra­ke­to dar­tyma Ra­miT, qa­laq tri­po­lis max­lob­lad mde­ba­re pa­les­ti­ne­li ltol­vi­le­bis ba­nak­Si gan­xor­ci­el­da da misi sa­miz­ne said ata­la ali iyo. me­o­re sa­ra­ke­to ie­ri­Sis Se­de­gad, ro­me­lic li­ba­nis qa­laq sa­ad­na­el­Tan ax­los gan­xor­ci­el­da, mu­ha­med hu­se­in al-la­vi­sis lik­vi­da­cia mox­da. „ha­ma­sma“ ori­ve maT­ga­nis sik­vdi­li da­a­das­tu­ra. ad­gi­lob­ri­vi me­di­is in­for­ma­ci­iT, Tav­das­xmis Se­de­gad da­Sav­da 3 ada­mi­a­ni da da­zi­an­da sa­cxov­re­be­li sax­le­bi. amasTan dakavSirebiT, jer kidev maSin, saf­ran­ge­Tis pre­zi­den­ti ema­nu­el mak­ron­i is­ra­e­lis­Tvis ia­ra­Ris mi­wo­de­be­bis Se­wyve­tis mo­wo­de­biT ga­mo­vi­da da ga­na­cxa­da, rom Ra­zis seq­tor­Si TiT­qmis er­Tw­li­a­ni omi „po­li­ti­kur mog­va­re­bas“ sa­Wi­ro­ebs. aRniSnuls israelis premieri gamoexmaura. „ira­nis bo­ro­te­bis Rer­Zis Se­mad­gen­lo­ba­Si myo­fi Cve­ni mtre­bis wi­na­aR­mdeg kon­trSe­te­va Cve­ni mo­mav­li­sa da usafr­Txo­e­bis uz­run­vel­sa­yo­fad au­ci­le­bel pi­ro­bas war­mo­ad­gens. oms da­vas­ru­lebT, ro­de­sac yve­la da­sa­xul mi­zans mi­vaR­wevT“, – ganacxada neTaniahum.

aSkaraa, rom am regionSi ramdenime dReSi ar dasruldeba msoflios cecxlis alSi gaxvevis mcdelobebi. ras fiqrobs amaze politologi soso manjaviZe? gTavazobT „aWarasTan“ mis intervius.

– batono soso, rogorc Tavad aRniSneT, israeli agrZelebs iranze Tavdasxmebs, rasac iranis mier sapasuxo saraketo Seteva mohyva. . .

– manamde vTqvi, rom israeli aris mxare, romelic cdilobs konfliqtis gamowvevas, rac aSkaraa da isev dasturdeba. rogorc xedavT, iranma aRar SearCina israels dartymebi, vgulisxmob libanze Setevas, beiruTis dabombvas da a.S. erTi Ra­mis gan­mav­lo­ba­Si, sa­ha­e­ro Za­le­bis mo­i­e­ri­Se TviTmfri­na­veb­ma daz­ver­vis sam­mar­Tve­los zus­ti daz­ver­vis xel­mZRva­ne­lo­biT ga­na­xor­ci­e­les wer­ti­lo­va­ni Tav­das­xme­bis se­ria mTel be­i­ruT­Si sab­rZo­lo ma­sa­lis ram­de­ni­me sa­wyo­bsa da sxva te­ro­ris­tu­l infras­truq­tu­raze. israelis Tavdacvis Zalebi acxadebdnen Semdeg, rom Tav­das­xme­bam­de mra­va­li na­bi­ji ga­da­id­ga, raTa Sem­ci­re­bu­li­yo zi­a­nis mi­ye­ne­bis San­si, maT So­ris, wi­nas­war gavafr­Txi­le­T te­ri­to­ri­is mo­sax­le­obao. magram faqtia, rom msxverpli iyo, ris gamoc gadausves xazi saerTaSoriso wesebs. swored amitom moaxdina Zalis demonstrireba iranma 500-mde raketiT, romelic israelis mimarTulebiT gauSva. . .

– mainc ratom daartyes mSvidobian mosaxleobas?

– maTi mtki­ce­biT, „hez­bo­la“ Ta­vis ia­raR­sa da war­mo­e­bis obi­eq­tebs be­i­ru­Tis cen­trSi, sa­cxov­re­be­li kor­pu­se­bis qveS aTav­sebs da safr­Txes uq­mnis mo­sax­le­o­bas. is­ra­e­lis Tav­dac­vis Za­le­bi ar malaven rom ga­ag­rZe­leben Se­te­vas da zi­a­nis mi­ye­ne­bas li­ban­Si, „hez­bo­las“ sam­xed­ro Se­saZ­leb­lo­be­bi­sa da infras­truq­tu­ris­Tvis. am Zli­eri Se­te­viT, zi­a­nis mi­ye­ne­biT igi Seecdeba „hez­bo­las“ sam­xed­ro Se­saZ­leb­lo­bebis da infras­truq­tu­ris degradacias li­ban­Si. amas­Tan, is­ra­e­lis Tav­dac­vis Za­le­bis Sta­bis uf­ros­ma her­zi ha­le­vim ga­na­cxa­da, rom is­ra­e­li „hez­bo­las“ po­zi­ci­eb­ze dar­tymebs Sem­su­bu­qe­bi­sa da Ses­ve­ne­bis ga­re­Se ga­ag­rZe­lebs „da­ma­te­bi­Ti da grZel­va­di­a­ni zi­a­nis Seq­mnisTvis“. irans sakuTari Zalebis demonstrirebis garda, sxva gamosavali ar hqonda. aqve vityvi, rom es ar iyo iranisTvis radikaluri nabiji, misi SesaZleblobebidan gamomdinare. kerZod, irans SeuZlia yvela erT saaTSi gauSvas igive raodenobis raketebi da miayenos israels Zalian didi ziani, magram kvlav moerida konfliqtis eskalacias.

– axla ra situaciaa?

– axla sakiTxi dgas ase: daartyams Tu ara israeli iranis navTobmompovebel, navTobgadamamuSavebel qarxnebs da birTvul programasTan dakavSirebul obieqtebs. ai, es mdgomarebaa da paralelurad mimdinareobs faruli brZola im Zalebs Soris, romlebic xedaven, rom konfliqtis eskalacia katasrofis momtani iqneba ara mxolod dapirispirebuli mxareebis, aramed mimdebare regionebisTvisac. es gamoiwvevs umarTav procesebs da arevs msoflio wesrigs.

– ras unda velodoT?

– amas uaxloesi momavali gviCvenebs, Tumca is, rac axla xdeba, ukve iwvevs SeSfoTebas. kerZod, iranma birTvuli iaraRis gamocda moawyo, risi kvalic eraySi dafiqsirda. eskalacia axal fazaSi Sedis, radgan manamde gacxadebuli hqonda aSS-s, rom ar dauSveben iranis atomur saxelmwifod qcevas. Sesabamisad, unda velodoT dartymas am mimarTulebiT. axla saubari aqvT „wiTeli xazebis“ gadakveTaze da mimdinareobs ganxilva. Tavad imdenjer gadakveTa israelma es xazebi, axla ratom ukvirT iranisgan, gaugebaria.

– kidev ra iwvevs TqvenSi gaugebrobas am konfliqtSi?

– saerTod, bevri logikuri kiTxva Cndeba, magaliTad, ratom aris israelis iranze Tavdasxma Tavdacva, gaugebaria. anu, rodesac israeli viRacas Tavs esxmis, Tavdacvad cxaddeba, xolo is viRaca pasuxs rom aZlevs – Tavdasxmad. uri ramea, ara?

– Tavad rogor xsniT am ormag standarts?

– israels marTavs neTaniahus eqstremistuli mTavroba. isini religiuri fanatikosebi arian da religiur fanatizms uxameben israelis gansakuTrebulobis doqtrinas, romlis mixedviTac qveyana unda gaxdes nacionaluri zesaxelmwifo. cxadia, rom amJamad amis realuri resursi israels ar aqvs, igi aris amerikis SeerTebuli Statebis wanazardi okeanis gaRma teritoriaze. aqedan gamomdinare, warmatebiT uxameben erTmaneTs nacionalur-religiur fanatizms, romelmac SesaZlebelia, ara mxolod es regioni, aramed mTeli msoflio gaxvios did gaugebrobaSi, rasac Tavadac vadevnebT Tvalyurs.

– mTavaria, Cven mxolod Tvalyuri vadevnoT.

– ratom, xom erTvebian Cvengan e.w. feisbuq-Sahidebi, feisbuq-lomebi da a.S. romlebic warmoudgenel raRacebs gaiZaxian, revolucia undaT da magar biWebad grZnoben Tavs? ra mohyveba amas qveynisTvis, arc ki ufiqrdebian. fsiqikurad Seryeuli adamianebis garda, maTi politikur velSi yofna aravis uxaria. furunkulebiviT mogvedvnen da unda gaskdnen erTxel da samudamod. xmamaRla yvirian nebismier rameze da ukvirT, ratom ar vasrulebT yvelafers, rasac iTxovs dasavleTi, romelic ukve iqca maTTvis religiur dogmad. aseT qarTvelebs moRalateebad vTvli, radgan ukanmouxedavad migvaqaneben omisa da ganadgurebisken.

– ra prognozs gaakeTebdiT 26 oqtombris arCevnebis Sedegebze? opozicia ukve acxadebs, rom 27–Si mitingebi daiwyeba..

– amaT arCevnebis Sedegebi ar ainteresebT, revolucia undaT daiwyon aSS-isa da misi mokavSireebis mier damuSavebuli feradi revoluciebis teqnologiebiT da scenariT. imdenad Setopes yalb emociebSi, arc ki ainteresebT, rom SesaZloa saqarTvelo saerTod waiSalos msoflio politikuri rukidan. samwuxarod, gvyavs aseTi `gienebi~ qveyanaSi. iginebian, ifurTxebian da qveynis sazianod moqmedeben. yvela sazogadoebaSia marginaluri niSa, sadac ukmayofiloTa 15-20% grovdeba Tu situacia mZafrdeba, 25%-mdec iyris Tavs. eg aris magaTi mTeli potenciali. rogorc wesi, is vinc yvelaze mets yviris, bariers ver gadalaxavs. CvenTvis mTavari Rirebulebebia mSvidoba, stabiluroba, ganviTareba da ara Tavs moxveuli marTvis modeli, viTom demokratia, romelic sinamdvileSi qaosia da mxolod garkveuli qveynebis keTildReobaze asxams wyals. aravis ainteresebs arc saqarTvelo da arc Cveni moqalaqeebis momavali, iseve, rogorc aRar ainteresebT ukraina da ukrainelebi. . .